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Author Topic: barrett jackson las vegas Z-28  (Read 69283 times)
GaryL
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« Reply #75 on: October 24, 2008, 08:50:31 PM »

Maybe we can take away an important lesson from all this.

Have the car checked before it is restored and/or take a lot of pictures during resto.
Take pictures of stripped vin area, tag area, all dates anywhere you can find them during resto.

Same with engine block. In a restored car a deck stamp can look pretty good but with the head off it can show an obvious decked block.

If you have a original stamped un-decked block, be sure to take pictues of the uncut deck with head off.

Take pictures of the sheet metal dates, crankshaft date code, rear end gears, etc. anything and everything you can find. It can't hurt.

Good lessons yes. I say if I was laying down the big bucks I want a guarantee, period. If not I don't buy it. How soon after buyers quit bidding will BJ require a guarantee from the seller?
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Gary

Lemans Blue X33. DZ, M20, manual steering. Only BU code rear end is original.
BillG
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« Reply #76 on: October 25, 2008, 08:20:19 AM »

Mabey we can take more than a lesson from this.  This high profile car is now in the spotlight for all to see.  The more I hear of what GAry and others have done, the less sympathy I have.  They know full well how loose tags and paperwork is going to be used.  The apparentness of what happened here seems to be backed up by many facts including the possible felonies being committed.  A court of law will have to decide this, and if that happens, this case and this car could be the start of stopping this trend of the auto faking and fraud.  Many opinions are being expressed here, but J.M. is not at fault here in any way.  He is in fact a victim the same as the buyer.  Everytime we see an example of this we are angered, but this time an opportunity has presented itself that may serve as a good example to fraud artists to reconsider their efforts.  I say, lets not let this die.  Just my opinion.
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Bill Garrett
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« Reply #77 on: October 25, 2008, 08:39:53 AM »

I'm not casting aspersions here, but If one removes the trim and VIN tags then trashs a body, only to sell the tags later will a passel of original documetation, why would one be suprised that it showed up on another car? What did you think was going to happen, the purchaser was going to take tags home and wax them, maybe make a key chain out of them?  If I was the seller of the tags I don't think I'd do anything to draw attention to it, like post it on the internet.
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GaryL
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« Reply #78 on: October 25, 2008, 12:02:46 PM »

I am sure the buyer did not scour ebay looking for a TT sale and rebody. The seller lied, period.
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Gary

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Camaroon
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« Reply #79 on: October 25, 2008, 06:04:16 PM »

"Truth is so obscure in these times, and falsehood so established, that, unless we love the truth, we cannot know it."
-- Blaise Pascal, 1660
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rockstar
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« Reply #80 on: October 25, 2008, 09:54:19 PM »


Here is some info that comes from a very reliable source.
The car did have a law enforcement vin#verifaction of all vin#s when it arrived at the resto shop before any work was done.
All previous owners were contacted prior to restoration including garys ex-wife.
Certification was done by Jerry without frontend on car and nothing was flagged.
There are over 1000 photos of the restoration.
There is a criminal investigation on-going requested by all parties involved.
There is registration that all parties have that proves the car was registered 2 -3 years after gary allegedly buried it.
clue, Pretty green car=money,greed,envy,jail
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RamAirDave
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« Reply #81 on: October 25, 2008, 10:55:12 PM »

There was two years between the tags/paper were sold alone on ebay and when it showed up again with a shell.

Out of the 1000 pics, are there any showing the backside of the hiddens to verify that they were NOT grafted in?
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firstgenaddict
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« Reply #82 on: October 25, 2008, 11:13:06 PM »

There was two years between the tags/paper were sold alone on ebay and when it showed up again with a shell.

Out of the 1000 pics, are there any showing the backside of the hiddens to verify that they were NOT grafted in?

Unfortunately the truth is that if the person who did the graft took the time to sand and polish the metal then blast front and back you would be damn hard pressed to tell... the best bet is to look at the date codes on the inner structures of the unibody and compare them to known cars built in the same period.
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James
Collectin' Camaro's since "Only Rednecks drove them"
 
Check out the Black 69 RS/Z28 45k mile Survivor and the Lemans Blue 69 Z 10D frame off...
https://picasaweb.google.com/112392262205377424364/1969_Z28_Restoration
GaryL
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« Reply #83 on: October 25, 2008, 11:22:29 PM »


.........There is a criminal investigation on-going requested by all parties involved.
There is registration that all parties have that proves the car was registered 2 -3 years after gary allegedly buried it.
clue, Pretty green car=money,greed,envy,jail


No wonder gary retracted.
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Gary

Lemans Blue X33. DZ, M20, manual steering. Only BU code rear end is original.
RamAirDave
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« Reply #84 on: October 25, 2008, 11:26:17 PM »

Unfortunately the truth is that if the person who did the graft took the time to sand and polish the metal then blast front and back you would be damn hard pressed to tell... the best bet is to look at the date codes on the inner structures of the unibody and compare them to known cars built in the same period.

True, James.  There would have to be extensive care to make them undetectable.  Could be done.  But what still doesnt change is the fact that the tags, one hidden that was cut out, and paper for this VIN were sold 5 years ago.  Plus the heater hidden that was not cut out, and supposedly died with the "buried" shell.

Maybe it was a one in a who-knows-what chance that the "buried" shell was reunited with the detached VINs.  Maybe the "buried" shell was salvaged.  Maybe, but the odds are against it.
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njsteve
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« Reply #85 on: October 26, 2008, 07:19:04 AM »


Here is some info that comes from a very reliable source.
The car did have a law enforcement vin#verifaction of all vin#s when it arrived at the resto shop before any work was done.
All previous owners were contacted prior to restoration including garys ex-wife.
Certification was done by Jerry without frontend on car and nothing was flagged.
There are over 1000 photos of the restoration.
There is a criminal investigation on-going requested by all parties involved.
There is registration that all parties have that proves the car was registered 2 -3 years after gary allegedly buried it.
clue, Pretty green car=money,greed,envy,jail



Yeah, real interesting esecially since "Rockstar" has no contact info and has a blocked email address. 

The fact that a car is "registered 2-3 years after Gary allegedly buired it" means nothing. That's just DMV paperwork. I know here in NJ you can sell a car and if you dont physically turn in the plates and cancel the registration, you will still get renewals every year...pay them and the car is still registered. Better yet, the QQ tags for classic cars are good forever with  no renewals.
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Mark
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« Reply #86 on: October 26, 2008, 07:53:38 AM »

The IP address for Rockstar is from tha Atlanta GA area.  Do we know anyone associated with this subject from that area?

OrgName:    BellSouth.net Inc.
OrgID:      BELL
Address:    575 Morosgo Drive
City:       Atlanta
StateProv:  GA
PostalCode: 30324
Country:    US

ReferralServer: rwhois://rwhois.eng.bellsouth.net:4321

The only way to get a title for the car would have been to go thru the registration process.  Anyone know what PA requires for documentation to register a car, although it may be a mute point becasue I assume whoever got the tags and paperwork from Gary got the title as well.  We all know (according to the story and info recorded by various people) that Gary sold (planned to sell?) the tags in April of 2004 and a car with his VIN was sold as a shell in October 2007 on Ebay, so what exactly was registered.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2008, 08:00:22 AM by Mark » Logged

Mark C.
1969 Indy Pace Car
350/300HP RPO Z11
JL8Jeff
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« Reply #87 on: October 26, 2008, 11:34:40 AM »

If the shell that Gary buried is still where he buried it and it has the hidden VIN by the heater opening, then it's an easy case.  But if Gary can't locate the shell he buried, then things will get real cloudy, especially when $$$ is involved.  I think we would all like to know if the car sold at auction was truly re-bodied regardless of the $$$.  Lots of clues point to yes, but I'm not convinced until Gary can produce the shell he buried.
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1969 Z28 JL8 4 wheel disc brakes, #'s match, crossram, GM fiberglass crossram hood, TI, Minilite wheels - being restored
Mark
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« Reply #88 on: October 26, 2008, 11:39:26 AM »

Have we all seen a picture of a section of the top of a cowl area containing a VIN?  Obviously a VIN stamp has been cut out of some car.  Can anyone read that VIN, and is it the same as the VIN and paper work associated with this car?

I don't beleive buried is a literal term, I think the body went to a bone yard.
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Mark C.
1969 Indy Pace Car
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666 the legend
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« Reply #89 on: October 26, 2008, 05:45:33 PM »

..Who the HELL buries a car..?? Seems like alot of work for JUNK..?? I just dont see someone burying a car......when yah can scrap it REAL EASY...!!
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67 SS/RS Royal Plum 4 speed...
68 Impala Custom
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