Author Topic: 69 original rear bumper identification  (Read 16071 times)

abiddle

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69 original rear bumper identification
« on: March 02, 2016, 08:24:08 PM »
Before I spend $400 buckaroos to rechrome my rear bumper, is there any way I can ID it as an original? The brackets and bolts are definitely original, but that doesn't mean hoohah. I'm questioning everything now...

Thanks - Andy

william

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2016, 08:35:24 PM »
Is the center bracket riveted to the bumper?
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abiddle

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2016, 10:31:53 PM »
Ughh. When I say No rivets, I assume that means I have a repro? I've attached a picture of the bumper and bracket.

william

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2016, 10:37:36 PM »
It's obvious the bracket was riveted in place. My guess, the bumper is original.
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Hans L

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2016, 10:49:41 PM »
I can't tell you if it's original or not, but agree with William it looks to be original.  For reference, here's what the rivets look like.   Your's could have been drilled out for re-chroming purposes.   





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'69 Camaro RS Z/28 Van Nuys Built
'69 Chevelle SS 396 4 Speed

Hans L

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2016, 10:58:34 PM »
And it appears you can buy reproduction rivets - just not sure where you can get them pressed in:

http://www.heartbeatcitycamaro.com/store/product/14044/Camaro-Rear-bumper-bracket-rivets-pr-1967-1968-1969/
https://www.instagram.com/69camarorsz28/
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68camaroz28

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2016, 01:00:50 AM »
And it appears you can buy reproduction rivets - just not sure where you can get them pressed in:

http://www.heartbeatcitycamaro.com/store/product/14044/Camaro-Rear-bumper-bracket-rivets-pr-1967-1968-1969/


Hans and everyone, those rivets do not look correct to me for what my rivets looked like or have observed on other cars. Maybe I'm missing something! As you mentioned Hans the big deal is finding a press big enough. I'm in that boat now as we have original looking rivets but have to press in after our bumper was re-chromed.
Chick
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X33RS

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2016, 01:38:23 AM »
My rivets look like that.  I wonder if they varied throughout production...

Sauron327

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2016, 03:48:13 AM »
Hans and everyone, those rivets do not look correct to me for what my rivets looked like or have observed on other cars. Maybe I'm missing something! As you mentioned Hans the big deal is finding a press big enough. I'm in that boat now as we have original looking rivets but have to press in after our bumper was re-chromed.
I have an original 1968 rear bumper with the riveted bracket and the backside is not flat as shown on the 69 bumper. But I would not assume all rivets are identical. I'll have to dig through old bumper stock to see what I can reference for 69.

Another reason to save every parts car and POS that comes along and toss it into inventory.

Hans L rivets look factory to me.

Hans L

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2016, 04:12:09 AM »
Hans and everyone, those rivets do not look correct to me for what my rivets looked like or have observed on other cars. Maybe I'm missing something! As you mentioned Hans the big deal is finding a press big enough. I'm in that boat now as we have original looking rivets but have to press in after our bumper was re-chromed.
I have an original 1968 rear bumper with the riveted bracket and the backside is not flat as shown on the 69 bumper. But I would not assume all rivets are identical. I'll have to dig through old bumper stock to see what I can reference for 69.

Another reason to save every parts car and POS that comes along and toss it into inventory.

Hans L rivets look factory to me.

I'm assuming Chick is referring to the HBC reproductions not the rivets on the bumper pics I posted above. Regarding the rivets shown in the pics I posted  - I have no reason to believe they are not factory originals.     

I'd also assume that whatever press is used, the pressed rivet result may not always look the same.   There is quite a bit a variability just between the two on my bumper. 
« Last Edit: March 03, 2016, 05:32:58 AM by Hans L »
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Bryan302

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2016, 06:26:40 AM »
Chick, Is it a known fact that the factory rivets in these bumpers were installed COLD.  If so, then a big press would be needed to simulate the process.  My curiosity of this process is because of my affiliation with restoring and collecting antique John Deere tractors and rivets this size are installed red hot with a smaller press or a pneumatic rivet squeezer.  Works like a charm.  In this application, I would think that the rivet after installment would have to be hand painted to protect or clear coated.  I would not think that this process would harm the chrome or the light housing.  Just a thought.

Bryan
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Gars68Tux

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2016, 08:06:26 AM »
Compare the weight of it with a known original. If it's significantly less, I'd say it's a reproduction. I compared 68 rear bumpers a few years ago and found some repro's weighing over 2 lbs less than an original. Now if it weighs about the same, there's no guarantee it's an original as I believe some repros MAY be of the same gauge steel. If that's the case, and it fits good, use it !  ;)
Garth

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abiddle

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2016, 01:38:12 PM »
It's obvious the bracket was riveted in place. My guess, the bumper is original.

Hi William - sorry I don't understand how its obvious this was riveted. When I took the bracket off, it was held by bolts. Are the reproductions held by bolts? I knew at some point the bumper had been removed from the car because several of the stainless headed bolts were loose.

abiddle

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2016, 01:41:04 PM »
Compare the weight of it with a known original. If it's significantly less, I'd say it's a reproduction. I compared 68 rear bumpers a few years ago and found some repro's weighing over 2 lbs less than an original. Now if it weighs about the same, there's no guarantee it's an original as I believe some repros MAY be of the same gauge steel. If that's the case, and it fits good, use it !  ;)

Yep it fits good. But I don't want to spend $400 rechroming a reproduction, when I can just get another reproduction for far less. I don't mind fixing an original, I don't want to fix a repro.

Does anyone have a repro off the car they can weigh? I know its not a definitive answer to being original. I guess from the discussion there are no stamps.

Thanks - Andy

william

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Re: 69 original rear bumper identification
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2016, 04:48:12 PM »
Hi William - sorry I don't understand how its obvious this was riveted. When I took the bracket off, it was held by bolts. Are the reproductions held by bolts? I knew at some point the bumper had been removed from the car because several of the stainless headed bolts were loose.

Many years ago I was involved with a Camaro parts business. In addition to the demands of the business we had our own personal project cars to deal with. There were few repro parts back then; just about everything came from GMPD. Bumpers were serviced without the center bracket. We had a machine shop make up a few dozen bolts with heads that resembled the factory rivets. So I cut off more than my share of original brackets. Yours happens to look exactly as I remember.

Just my opinion for what it is worth. Not engraved in marble.

A few memories of bumpers. By the late ‘80s GMPD service bumpers were of poor quality. The nickel wasn’t polished very well; scratches and grinding scars were obvious. The plating had no brilliance at all, much like flash-chromed air cleaner lids. For some time ’69 rears were missing one bolt hole. Beware the ‘NOS’ bumper. Or any late ‘80s GMPD part.

I recall the first shipments of repros. While the quality seemed much better they were tightly encased in bubble-wrap. The wrap abraded the plating in transit. So there were bubble wrap spots all over them. I'm sure that has been resolved.

In my 40+ years of the hobby I have seen chrome plating vary widely in initial quality and long-term durability. A bud had a shop in town do the bumpers on his ’57 years ago. Not only did they do a lousy job, buffing through the chrome in a few places today they are badly pitted despite climate-controlled storage. Make sure the shop you are using is experienced in chroming large parts. And skip the show chrome.

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