AACA/ISCA

[IZRSSS]

Can someone tell me the differences between these judged events?  In addition, can you please tell me if there are levels of certification and a point spread for each? For example, Classic Chevy International in conjunction with the World Camaro Club {sorry for bringing them up but they are the only ones I am familiar with} have four levels of certification and a point spread for each...bronze-silver-gold-platinum. I believe the point spread for platinum is 970-1000.

In addition, If your car was entered into AACA and fared well, can you expect the same from ISCA or is the judging criteria completely different?

Thanks

[maroman]

AACA judgeing does not check for numbers matching like other organisations. The cars can be shown with ANY factory option, color, or interior available the year the cars was made. It is to be presented in a condition as it "could have been delivered" in. Judgeing is mostly about condition and cleanliness. Deductions  for anything aftermarket, radio, valve covers, etc. Their rules have to stretch from the beginning of cars to 25 years ago.

[IZRSSS]

I was told by a guy I met a few years back that ISCA's judging criteria is very stringent and you have to attend several A & AA shows a head of time just to qualify. Another thing he mentioned is that these shows are more about glitz & glitter then factory correct. I am not sure if he was talking about specific categories or if this holds true for all entries. I checked out their site and if I read it correctly, around 90% of all categories are for Customs or Mild Customs and the only categories our cars would fall under is the Restored Class. It seems to me that AACA would be a much better fit.

Thanks maroman 

[maroman]

If you go to AACA's site there's an online judgeing manual. When you are confused, MAYBE I can help or maybe Lakeholme will get involved.

[lakeholme]

Maroman is giving you good advice. Check out the AACA website for the guidelines (not a manual), and while you are there, look at the judging section in the forums. Then send me a PM if you have questions.
The owner has to provide factory documentation, if asked. That sort of explains how one can judge so many different cars.

[maroman]

I wasn't paying attention to your avitar before, but YOUR car is a perfect example of needing factory documentation. Because your car is not painted a standard color for '69 you would need some type of factory document to receive full credit. I don't THINK you would need proof your car was painted that exact color, just that it has a special paint code.

[camaronut]

Do you know about the VCCA (Vintage Chevrolet Club of America)?.....same as the AACA, except Chevrolet only.
 
I have Preservation awards from both, but they judge the same way....correctness / cleanliness.  Both orgs really don't care about #'s matching, and I wasn't too impressed with the judges at these events.  

I found the judges at the VCCA / AACA events totally inept in Camaro specific items....they think whats ok in an Impala should be the same in a Camaro.

Personally, I think a cert from the Camaro Nationals means more.....IMHO.

But they do have a nice little oval thingy to put on your grille....makes you feel important.  Sorry...I digress a little....

What maroman said on the second thread pretty-well sums it up.....

[lakeholme]

Well, the team captain would ask for "factory documentation". So, I'd bring something that showed how your tag reveals special paint and a paint chart chip for your color. In other words, prove that the factory could have painted a 69 Camaro that color. The key word is "factory".
There are plenty of times we see special paint or an unexpected color on the field. Early 70s Mopars, for example.

Thinking about AACA vs ISCA (and I enjoy both), it is like apples and oranges, but it is all fruit!  Factory original vs show modification.

[IZRSSS]

I broused through the AACA Guidelines and they are very similar to Top New Mexico Shows like the SW Muscle Car Nationals & the Super Nationals. And...trust me, if its documentation that's needed, then documentation is what I'll have...six month's worth of non stop research. A royal pain in the #$#@... but well worth it.

I'd like to find out more information about the Camaro Nationals. I think I'll spend some time on-line to find out more information about this. Don't know much about it but just the name sounds like its pretty impressive.

Thanks Guys!

[camaronut]

If you have a totally numbers-matching car, then the Camaro Nationals certification means more to the overall pedigree of your car then some meaningless award from VCCA / AACA / ISCA.  

But some folks really get off on that stuff........OOOOOOHHHHHH I gotta little oval thingy on my grille......OOOHHHHHHH (hummmm I wonder where mine is.....I think I saw it in my toolbox somewhere...)

After "been there - done that", I can tell ya....when you ever sell your car, you'll get more respect from folks with a Certification from the Camaro Nationals -------- from judges who know Camaros rather from some hokey establishment that "stamps" an award from folks who don't know crap about Camaros......Sorry...I digress a little......  

And since you have a "unique paint" car.....a certification is even more important.....

[tmodel66]

When you say "Totally Matching Numbers" are you talking about drive train or does this include all components? I have all the numbers off my sheet metal. What other numbers would I need?

[IZRSSS]

Come on camaronut play nice. I think we've all seen Scent Of A Woman and the line was much more appropriate there...not half bad on Sinfield either.

To say the above shows are meaningless is pretty harsh to say the least. I have met a lot of great people on this site who are affiliated with some of these and are extremely knowledgeable when it comes to First Gens. They also work there behinds off to give everyone a chance to compete at those shows and I am sure the owners of these cars learn a great deal. The sad thing is that it only takes one bad judge to ruin the entire experience.

However, I do think you are correct in saying the Camaro Nationals is perhaps the pinnacle of these competitions but the sad thing is...not everyone can compete at that level. From what little I know of the CN, you'd better be willing to spend some huge money if you hope to compete. I guess this was the main point of my question...With regards to the Camaro Nationals...are there levels of competition or are all cars fresh off of a 70-90K restoration?

[IZRSSS]

I have all the numbers off my sheet metal.

Are they this ANAL ?

I think you have it confused with the Vintage Certification Program...

[LB68SS350]

Check out this link. A lot of good info there.  Larry       http://www.mdcamaroclub.com/Nationals.htm

[camaronut]

Yeah, maybe I was a little harsh....my apologies, I hope I didn't offend anyone associated with the AACA / VCCA / ISCA.....I'm sure there are some knowledgeable people at these orgs...but when you have a judge argue that you have the wrong antenna installed on your car, and you prove him wrong.....(luckily, another Camaro owner had one of McNeish's book)...and he quits on the spot due to "lack of training"...that has to tell you something.....

There were other folks at the same show having the same difficulties...whatever.....that's water under the bridge....

You seem to have a "special" car......being that said, then you need to secure it's pedigree by being awarded by your peers who are knowlegeable on Camaros, and would steer you in the right direction in getting things done right.

I believe you would get into the Heartbeat Class and move up from there.....how far you move up is up to you and your wallet.....but if you have a numbers matching car...I'd invest in the certification from the Nationals....it'll pay dividends later.