Author Topic: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE  (Read 8788 times)

GI JOE

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #30 on: December 31, 2012, 07:55:24 AM »
this is interesting history...   :)

How long did it take to ship the engine to the assembly plant?  Does anyone have any photos of the S&H?

Just so I am clear... the block stamp is the complete engines assembly date, correct? ...or is it the short block???

Why we are on this subject... how long did it take to ship the frame, rears axle and trans to the assembly plant? 

i would assume... (there is that word again, LOL) that all the components were sent palatalized and the pallet did not leave until it was a full pallet... assuming this then the pallet would have older and more recent engines being sent at one time .  Can anyone shine some light on this?


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JohnZ

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #31 on: December 31, 2012, 04:53:01 PM »
<<How long did it take to ship the engine to the assembly plant?  Does anyone have any photos of the S&H?

Just so I am clear... the block stamp is the complete engines assembly date, correct? ...or is it the short block???

Why we are on this subject... how long did it take to ship the frame, rears axle and trans to the assembly plant?  

i would assume... (there is that word again, LOL) that all the components were sent palatalized and the pallet did not leave until it was a full pallet... assuming this then the pallet would have older and more recent engines being sent at one time .  Can anyone shine some light on this? >>

Engines were shipped by rail, and it took a couple of days to get from Flint V-8 to Norwood by the time the rail cars were loaded, marshalled, made up into a train, travelled, split at the receiving marshalling yard, and moved inside the plant for unloading. Add another three days to get to Van Nuys. Engines were shipped three to a steel rack, stacked four racks high in the rail cars, and the rail cars returned the empty racks back to the engine plants - see photo below of racked Tonawanda big-blocks being unloaded.

The engine started down the assembly line at the engine plant as a bare block, upside-down, with the suffix code written on the side of the block in grease pencil so the assemblers knew what innards to install in it; after it was flipped right-side-up and the heads went on, the front pad was stamped with the plant identifier, assembly date, and suffix code. On big-blocks, Tonawanda stamped the code on the front pad BEFORE the heads went on, so the big plug on the front of the head didn't interfere with the gang-stamp holder, and there was nothing in the way of the assembly plant-applied VIN derivative stamp on the inboard end of the pad.

Frames and subframes were shipped stacked on open rail cars, and axles and automatic transmissions were shipped in enclosed rail cars in returnable steel racks similar to the engine racks; manual transmissions were strapped in stacked wooden pallets.

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MO

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #32 on: January 01, 2013, 04:18:59 AM »
John...sidebar; why are some vin stamps upside down? Heads on or off maybe making more room for the gang stamp?

firstgenaddict

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #33 on: January 01, 2013, 04:27:58 AM »
John...sidebar; why are some vin stamps upside down? Heads on or off maybe making more room for the gang stamp?

I feel pretty certain in stating an absolute here... VIN stamps for Camaros were ALWAYS done with the heads on no matter whether they are SB or BB or assembled at Van Nuys or Norwood.

Some VIN derivatives are gang stamped some are not, some have single number stamp overs and some have the pad ground and individually stamped. Humans performed most processes so various anomalies exist. 
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GI JOE

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #34 on: January 01, 2013, 12:18:55 PM »
Thanks JohnZ,

That is one cool photo and BB to Boot... made my New years... ;D\\GI Joe
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bergy

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #35 on: January 01, 2013, 02:14:35 PM »
Great pic JohnZ!  That RR track went right by the front of the foundry and continued on (switched) over to the Chevrolet Forge.  All 3 plants were on the same property.  The G&A plant was across town.  Switch yard was across the street from the 3 plants.  We lost more then one ZL1 over in that switch yard!

Mike S

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #36 on: January 01, 2013, 03:41:45 PM »
.................... Humans performed most processes so various anomalies exist. 

I can certainly attest to this comment. My 67 4B LOS 396 that I have owned since 1980 has:
1- Double strike for the engine prefix (ghosting)
2- Misplaced year and plant code sequence in the VIN ( instead of 7L it is L7)
3- The last digit in the VIN stamp is a 1 and the VIN tag and hidden VIN is a 7

Mike
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JohnZ

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #37 on: January 01, 2013, 04:05:02 PM »
I feel pretty certain in stating an absolute here... VIN stamps for Camaros were ALWAYS done with the heads on no matter whether they are SB or BB or assembled at Van Nuys or Norwood.

That's what I said above - the heads-on/heads-off stamping referred to the ENGINE PLANT machine code, not the assembly plant-applied VIN derivative stamp.
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Mike S

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #38 on: January 01, 2013, 06:53:48 PM »
.................... Humans performed most processes so various anomalies exist.  

I can certainly attest to this comment. My 67 4B LOS 396 that I have owned since 1980 has:
1- Double strike for the engine prefix (ghosting)
2- Misplaced year and plant code sequence in the VIN ( instead of 7L it is L7)
3- The last digit in the VIN stamp is a 1 and the VIN tag and hidden VIN is a 7

Mike

 To show an interesting comparison and how human error James eluded to can be consistant at times, below are 2 pictures of 67 BB's from the LOS plant.
The one titled 'L7-vin' is a picture taken from my 67 4B car.
The one titled 'big block-from CGR' was taken from a CRG thread:
 (http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=8278.msg62099#msg62099 ) that is close to my S/N and also stamped with the same errors...upside down and the 7L reversed with L7 but interesting enough is the way the gang stamp was held on an angle being top heavy and the bottoms faint impression. This tells me it may be the same person who stamped both blocks.

Mike
67 LOS SS/RS L35 Hardtop - Original w/UOIT
67 NOR SS/RS L35 Convertible - Restored

MO

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #39 on: January 01, 2013, 11:48:53 PM »
"I feel pretty certain in stating an absolute here... VIN stamps for Camaros were ALWAYS done with the heads on no matter whether they are SB or BB or assembled at Van Nuys or Norwood. "

Yeah...I didn't think that through all the way. Of course the heads are on because the vin's are stamped after being assigned to a car; not at the engine plant. Thanks for straightening me out.

myty

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #40 on: January 03, 2013, 12:48:09 AM »
 My 02A 1969 Z28  (1st week Feb.)   Block cast A289                         (Jan. 28,1969)
                                                     Eng. Code V0130DZ                   (Jan. 30, 1969) V is Flint.  DZ is 69 302

                                                   Also, Differential BV0128G2          (Jan.28,1969)  BV is 4.10 Gears.
                                                              Cast A169                       (Jan.28,1969)  G is gear and axle plant.  2 is 2nd shift.   Gary.
          
« Last Edit: January 03, 2013, 06:49:20 PM by Ed Bertrand »

z28z11

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #41 on: January 03, 2013, 03:41:08 AM »
My 02A 1969 Z28  (2nd week Feb.)   
                                                   

Second week ?                                                   
                               
         
1968 Z28 M21/U17 BRG/W
1969 Z28 X77/M20/VE3 LeMans/W
1969 L78 X66/N66 Cortez/BVT
1969 Z11 L48/M35/C60/C06

myty

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #42 on: January 03, 2013, 03:05:57 PM »
Opps, can I fix that? I dont see an edit

1968 Z28

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #43 on: January 03, 2013, 06:38:24 PM »
Opps, can I fix that? I dont see an edit
Can't remember exactly how long but......the edit function disappears after a certain length of time.  You can click on the "Report To Moderator" and send a message to Kurt to correct what you need.
Jerry G.

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Ed_B

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Re: BLOCK CAST DATE VS PAD STAMP DATE
« Reply #44 on: January 03, 2013, 06:50:37 PM »
Quote
Opps, can I fix that? I dont see an edit

20 minutes to make changes then it's there forever!! However, I fixed it for you.

Ed