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Author Topic: CRG Member  (Read 3076 times)
pjbizjak
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« on: July 21, 2012, 06:06:21 PM »

I'm looking for a CRG member that lives close to Lawrence KS. Anyone?
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1968RSZ28
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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2012, 06:41:44 PM »

Sorry Pete, I'm 1848 miles from Lawrence, KS.

Paul
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LVN 67
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« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2012, 08:37:38 PM »

  I live right up the road in Leavenworth.   Smiley
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Mark
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2012, 08:42:43 AM »

  I live right up the road in Leavenworth.   Smiley

Inside or outside the prison? Grin
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Mark C.
1969 Indy Pace Car
350/300HP RPO Z11
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2012, 09:24:04 AM »

If I had a dollar for everyone on those, Id be looking for a 69 COPO or ZL-1 with cash in hand.  Im outside, but Ft Leavenworth did build their new jail right across the street.   Grin
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pjbizjak
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« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2012, 09:50:13 AM »

LVN 67; I'm interested in a pair of 2.02 fulie heads from Craigslist from a guy in Lawrence and I need someone to be my eyes because I live in Ohio and that's a little far to travel to check them out. Can you help?
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LVN 67
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« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2012, 12:13:41 PM »

pjbizjak, Bummer, I 'm leaving for Florida later this afternoon, and will be gone about 2 weeks. If its not too late when I get back, I'll be happy to go look. I'm not much of an engine guy, but I can get some pictures for you.   Smiley
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2012, 01:31:00 PM »

Is this the ad advertising a set of 291 double hump heads?  If so, it is hard to tell from the photos, see why you would want a set of eyes for a first hand look.  I would say that they need to be cleaned up and magnafluxed to know if they are any good, otherwise you would be taking a chance.  Did notice that they have been modified for guide plates, not completely stock heads.

Just my two cents worth.
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Jerry G.

Z28-1968-07C-Norwood
Ermine White, Red Std. Interior
2 Owner, 38,000 miles
pjbizjak
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« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2012, 01:43:56 PM »

Thanks again LVN 67, have a good trip, we'll see when you get back.

1968 z28; The ad was on Graigs list and I got some extra pics he sent me, they look good.

Thanks Pete
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2012, 02:16:47 PM »

Just a heads up...if they have added hardened seats for the exhaust valves, there is a possibility of the seats leaking water.  Sometimes when they grind into the seat area for the hardened exhaust seats they get very close to the water jackets or even break into the water jackets.  That is one reason why I mentioned that they might need to be magnafluxed.  I prefer to start out with a set of virgin, magnafluxed, 1.95 set of heads and have them modified to factory specs for the 2.02 valves.  Cost a little more, but at least you know their good.
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Jerry G.

Z28-1968-07C-Norwood
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dannystarr
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« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2012, 03:53:49 PM »

I am sure most of you know the score on the heads. How they have a different thickness in certain spots etc. But here is a little comparison for fun.
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dannystarr
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« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2012, 03:57:37 PM »

Here is a couple more shots of original heads. NOT 194's that have been punched up.
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2012, 04:41:35 PM »

Danny....You are so right.....good call.  Many of the 1.94 to 2.02 modded heads don't include the intake valve radius cuts to open up the area between the intake valve and the cylinder wall.  This radius cut accounts for the thinner area between the two adjacent intake valves.  If this mod is not done then the modded heads will flow less air than the original 1.94 heads.

I have a set of 291 heads that I had modified from 1.94 to 2.02 valves recently and I made it a point to get the machinist to open up the intake valve area. 

I went back and looked at the photos of the heads I was referring to in the Craiglist ad above and it appears to me that the intakes have not been opened up.  All the spacing's between the cylinders look the same.
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Jerry G.

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pjbizjak
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« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2012, 08:02:18 PM »

Dannystar; If I send you a picture clould you tell me if the heads are original 2.02's. I would need your email address.

Pete
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dannystarr
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« Reply #14 on: July 24, 2012, 02:00:09 AM »

I can give it a shot. There is much more knowledgable guys on this site than I. William, JohnZ, Jerry M, Paul, and the list goes on and on. Problem is, ya gotta be able to see if they have been cut. Ya need to see the difference in the casting. When you cut a 194 head, even if you relieve the correct area's, the casting from the cut shows differently. It's not as smooth in that transition area. But sometimes, TOO smooth. I hate it when they do that. I understand the reasons, they want the stronger thicker casting. PM me and I'll take a look. Here is the kinda shots I need... Danny
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JohnZ
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« Reply #15 on: July 24, 2012, 10:17:45 AM »

There's no difference in the castings between 1.94" and 2.02" heads - they're the same casting. The difference in the apparent thickness between chambers with adjacent intake valves and adjacent exhaust valves is a result of the material removed from the side of the chamber wall when the factory unshouding cut was made. Photo below is a 2.02" 462 chamber that shows the amount of material removed; machining was the same for 2.02" 461/462/291/186 heads.
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'69 Z/28
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pjbizjak
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« Reply #16 on: July 24, 2012, 06:55:43 PM »

Dannystar, JohnZ; The pictures I have are in the form of an email that I can forward, that's the only way I can get them to you.

Pete
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pjbizjak
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« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2012, 07:00:57 PM »

Oh the other reason I'm persuing this issue is because the heads are 'date correct' for my 04A built Z/28 engine with a build date of 0329MO. The heads are dated c208 & c218, I have one original head that is dated c238.
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dannystarr
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« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2012, 09:20:37 PM »

JohnZ, I messed up my wording. Of course the casting is the same. I meant after the cutting. It seems that if the cutting is done by a machine shop, 35 years later, you can see that it's just not factory. Or at least I think I can tell. But like I told him, I am last on the list on this site for knowledge. Or close to the bottom. Because looking at your picture, that to me looks like it was a 194 casting that has been punched up to a 2.02. Just doesn't look right to me. Looks like an after market relief job. Like I said, what do I know.  Grin Huh  

pjbizjak, send them to me at this email. djc@vom.com

Then I will try to load them on here for John and the guys to see.
  Danny
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dannystarr
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« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2012, 04:36:23 PM »

Here are pjbizjak heads he is interested in buying. Are they real 202's??? Doesn't look right to me, not enough relief. The more I look at JohnZ's last picture, the better it now looks.... Danny
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TODD
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« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2012, 08:34:05 PM »

So are the guides drilled out and these new guides added? Also looks like its got scew in studs, what are your plans for rockers the stock "O" rockers?
Those new studs can cause geometry issues if they have the guide locked in the wrong position. I'd try to find a set with original studs (pressed) and no guide work. But thats just me, lots  of extra effort downstream dependant upon what you are doing.
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tmodel66
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« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2012, 11:32:24 PM »


Those new studs can cause geometry issues if they have the guide locked in the wrong position. I'd try to find a set with original studs (pressed) and no guide work. But thats just me, lots  of extra effort downstream dependant upon what you are doing.

Todd can you elaborate a little on the issues you mentioned if the guides a locked in the wrong position?
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Daniel  
'69 SS 350/4 speed  Fathom Green--POP
pjbizjak
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« Reply #22 on: July 26, 2012, 09:32:05 AM »

I'm not too concerned about the guides because they can be removed, I do like the screw in studs. I'm mainly interested in these heads because the are 'date correct' for my engine.

Pete
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pjbizjak
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« Reply #23 on: July 26, 2012, 09:38:20 AM »

Dannystar; Great job on the pics, thank you.
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #24 on: July 26, 2012, 10:28:43 AM »

I'm not too concerned about the guides because they can be removed, I do like the screw in studs. I'm mainly interested in these heads because the are 'date correct' for my engine.

Pete
That depends....in the old scheme of things the holes that the pushrods went through in the  heads served as the guides....they were shaped to hold the pushrods in alignment, ie...they served as guides.  When you convert to guide plates, they now serve as the guides and in order to keep the two methods from interfering with each other the holes in the head were reamed out to keep the pushrods from touching the head.  So now you have to use the guide plates.  It looks to me that the holes in these heads have been reamed out.

I did the same thing to my original heads and I now regret it....I am trying to restore my car to original.  But, I continued to search for the right date coded heads and I finally found a set of date correct, magnafluxed, 1.94s and with the right machinest can be converted to work and look like my originals.

So....keep looking.
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Jerry G.

Z28-1968-07C-Norwood
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dannystarr
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« Reply #25 on: July 26, 2012, 10:54:52 AM »

pjbizjak you are welcome. At least we got them posted. I had to fool with them and resize them etc. But we we got her done.
 I agree with all above info, I would skip these. The heads you see in the picture were for my Z/28. But I lost that car as some of you may remember. So I had alot of parts I collected and sold most on this site. No reason to keep them and needed the dough. Good luck in your search, I will look for a set for ya here in Northern CA. Give me all the build date info on your car.... Danny
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #26 on: July 26, 2012, 01:15:22 PM »

Well.....actually I found two sets of date correct 1.94 heads. Bought the first set on eBay cheap, a set of heads just taken off an old motor, not cleaned and magnafluxed. The set I thought looked great and took them to the machinist to be modified to the 2.02 specs.  When the machinist got them cleaned up he found that one head had cracks on two of the rocker stud mounts. So he then had to machine the stud mounts down and install screw in studs.  I didn't like the looks of the fix so I decided to keep searching for another set.

I kept searching on the internet and finally found a set at a machine/race shop in Pennsylvania that was date correct (even closer to my originals than the first set, within a couple of days), cleaned, magnafluxed, and unmolested. I did have to pay more money but at least I now have something that is good from the start.

So the moral is.....keep looking and make sure you buy something that isn't junk.
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Jerry G.

Z28-1968-07C-Norwood
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JohnZ
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« Reply #27 on: July 27, 2012, 11:56:20 AM »

The bottom photo in reply #19 is a 1.94" head that's been opened up to 2.02", without doing the unshrouding cut; the flow restriction around the outboard portion of the intake valve is very obvious.
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'69 Z/28
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pjbizjak
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« Reply #28 on: July 27, 2012, 01:33:27 PM »

Man you Guys are awesome. I'm convinced and  I am passing up on the subject heads and I'll keep looking. Thanks to all!

Pete
68 04A Z/28 Rally Green
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68Zproject
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« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2012, 02:16:20 PM »

Jerry, could you pm what you paid for the heads if you don't mind.  I have the same crack issues on my heads that I just got studs put in.
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68Z28
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« Reply #30 on: July 27, 2012, 03:50:47 PM »

Jerry, could you pm what you paid for the heads if you don't mind.  I have the same crack issues on my heads that I just got studs put in.
Harv....Done.  BTW....did they crack while pressing in the new studs or were they already cracked?
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Jerry G.

Z28-1968-07C-Norwood
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pjbizjak
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« Reply #31 on: July 31, 2012, 08:31:45 PM »

The 2.02 heads in question are now on E-Bay, search 23917291. Did they do screw in studs & guide plates 25 years ago?
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #32 on: July 31, 2012, 09:27:04 PM »

Not ever on the 291 heads.  In 1970 they started the screw in studs and guide plates on the Corvette HP engines and the Camaro Z28 350ci (186 heads).....so that would be 42 years ago.
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Jerry G.

Z28-1968-07C-Norwood
Ermine White, Red Std. Interior
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