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Author Topic: 1967 Small Journal 350  (Read 5161 times)
erikjohn
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« on: July 27, 2011, 09:57:44 AM »


http://www.camaros.org/askcrg-archives.shtml

The answer given in question 11 implies that there is no such thing.  I myself have a 67 RS/SS built in Nov 66 and I discovered that it had small journals when I was doing the rebuild on it 20 years ago when I ordered the larger journal bearings and they did not fit properly.  My car is all numbers matching(Vin-Eng-Trans-Rear Axle), I have full documentation of the car including the POP.

Has this issue been revisited as I really don't find much on the internet on it and the general consensus seems to be that all 350 are large journal.

Thanks
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CNorton
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« Reply #1 on: July 27, 2011, 10:36:45 AM »

Did you verify the stroke?  A 3.48" stroke crankshaft with small journals would indeed be a rare object for factory production but one routinely turned out by race shops.  There was a point in time when Super Stock racers turned down the main journals of 350 crankshafts to the 327 bearing size in the search for more power.  Of course, that business is still thriving and they're now down to using Honda rod bearing sizes for the same reason.
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KurtS
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« Reply #2 on: July 27, 2011, 10:58:01 AM »

It's been revisited several times. Never seen a factory small journal 350.
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erikjohn
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« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2011, 11:24:46 AM »

It's been revisited several times. Never seen a factory small journal 350.
Without trying to be argumentative but this an honest question.  If you did see one how would you know it was factory? Since it wasn't documented as such but the fact that there have been reports of them indicates something.

My car was completely unmolested when it came to my family back in the mid 80's, my dad was the third owner and it was purchased from a friend of a friend so we knew the cars history quite well.  I did the rebuild in 1988 and haven't touched it since.  When it was done the engine had never been rebuilt or touched prior to that which was obvious when I took the engine apart.  It was definitely a 350, I started measured everything when realized after torquing down the bolts there was a bunch of play in the journals.  Plus the VIN stamped on the engine matches everything else on the car and it is a true RS/SS so that also makes it a genuine 350.

At the time I was told by a local expert(prior to all of the internet experts) that it was an "experimental" motor that only came in the the early 350 RS/SS models but I have not seen anything online or anywhere that verifies this.  The engine build date is Nov 8th 1966 (V1108MS) and the first cars available to public were Sept 26th 1966 which I guess means the components were built a month prior to that.

I must suspect that there are more of these factory small journal 350's out there but I just find it very unusual that this has not been more well documented or even officially somehow verified by the experts.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 12:39:45 PM by erikjohn » Logged

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erikjohn
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« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2011, 01:27:17 PM »

As I try to dig further into this I also see that in the GM Spec book for the 67 Camaro, page 33 of 212 indicates that there was a a revision to the crankshaft information in Jan 1967 however it does not show specifically what info was changed with regards to crankshafts only that there was a revision.  It would be interesting to see the manual pre-revision to see what actually changed.  From my perspective the obvious assumption would be they revised the journal size of the crank thus the need for revision.

The manual can be downloaded here:
http://www.gmheritagecenter.com/gm-heritage-archive/docs/Camaro/1967-Chevrolet-Camaro.pdf
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1968 Z28
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« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2011, 03:46:23 PM »

Do you have the casting numbers located on the crank?  Do you know for sure whether it is forged or cast? 

Also, you mentioned that you rebuilt the engine, did you send the crankshaft out to a machine shop?  If so, did they turn the journals?
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Jerry G.

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« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2011, 04:17:30 PM »

No I don't have the number cause didn't think to do that at the time.  I can't say for sure if forged or cast because it was 25 years ago last time I laid eyes on it but the block is part of a numbers matching car so I assume it is forged as were all 67 350 cranks.

I did not have any work done to the crank, it never left my garage.  The only work I had done was to the double hump heads.  I had a 3 angle valve job and had hardened seats installed.  I also replaced the original flat tops with 9:1 pistons so it would run on 87 pump gas.  I also installed a crane 290H fireball cam and a new double roller timing chain.  I did not replace the cam bearings.

When I pulled it apart it everything looked stock, no aftermarket parts.  The outside of the engine did not have any aftermarket parts either.  Had original carb, intake and exhaust manifolds.  I wouldn't think someone would go through the trouble of grinding down the crank mains and do nothing else to the engine, that makes no sense.

There is absolutely no reason to believe that a SJ350 was made other than lack of something in writing from GM(that still exists).  It also makes sense that the first 350s were small journals, since it was based on the 327 block and the casting numbers were the same.  In fact I would say it is 100% sure that the first 350's were small journal it just wasn't documented that they were put into production cars.  But it was a first year car, a first year motor, they were making additions on fly and adding options through early 1967, I don't see how this is that hard to fathom.  Clearly they rushed it to production because of the addition of the rear stab bar that came later.

I need someone to tell me what it would take to rewrite the history books.  I am confident I have the real deal, I just need to know how to prove it and I would love to be the guy to do it.
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« Reply #7 on: July 27, 2011, 05:40:23 PM »

Been working on cars for 35 years and never saw one but good luck.
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Daniel  
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« Reply #8 on: July 27, 2011, 06:06:31 PM »

Many years ago the world was also flat before it was round. Wink
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erikjohn
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2011, 06:39:55 PM »

I am calling out to all nay-sayers and experts.  I am in Orlando-FL area.  I will seriously tear apart this engine and display for any expert that will come to check it out to put this to bed.  Please put the call out.


PM me with any serious inquires of someone that can validate this engine.

My email is erikjohn@hotmail.com

Thanks all.

EJ
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« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2011, 08:02:23 PM »

Stories that begin with...my completely unmolested car that was bought from a friend of a friend always scare me. No telling what was done to the car by the time your family took position of it in the mid 80's. Please keep in mind that CRG has the largest and most extensive data base in the world for First Gen Camaros. If there was such an animal it would be on here. The quote below is but one sample of many you will find if you take the time to search the web, which BTW is identical to what you found here.

The year 1967 also saw the introduction of the 350ci engine. This now classic configuration utilized a 4.000in bore with a 3.480in stroke, and has probably become the most common engine size. Along with the introduction of the 350 came the standardization on the "big main journals".

I would be very interested to see pics of the engine stamp, rear, tran. and vin# of the car...
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erikjohn
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« Reply #11 on: July 27, 2011, 08:19:09 PM »

Stories that begin with...my completely unmolested car that was bought from a friend of a friend always scare me. No telling what was done to the car by the time your family took position of it in the mid 80's. Please keep in mind that CRG has the largest and most extensive data base in the world for First Gen Camaros. If there was such an animal it would be on here. The quote below is but one sample of many you will find if you take the time to search the web, which BTW is identical to what you found here.

The year 1967 also saw the introduction of the 350ci engine. This now classic configuration utilized a 4.000in bore with a 3.480in stroke, and has probably become the most common engine size. Along with the introduction of the 350 came the standardization on the "big main journals".


I hear you, and that is why I am here at this site with my request.  I will tear my car down I just need to be put in touch with the right people that have the credentials and knowledge to be able to make a judgement.  No body here has given me anything that convinces me otherwise other than they haven't seen it, or it's not in the books etc.  Well the books were revised, several times and no one has the original sheets.  I have been a car guy for over 25 years myself and I didn't just fall into a car that I am trying to justify.  I am not here to cause waves or ruffle feathers but I need some closure on this.  The fact that my car is so well documented and was previously untouched I feel that I have to pursue this further.  I found the small journals myself prior to having any knowledge that it was even a possibility.  Again please see my information and email me with an further information you can provide.

Thank you.
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« Reply #12 on: July 27, 2011, 08:22:24 PM »

Who knows...given the build date of your car you might be on to something. If it's possible post a pic of the Cowl Tag & Engine Pad.
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erikjohn
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« Reply #13 on: July 27, 2011, 09:00:36 PM »

Cowl tag
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« Reply #14 on: July 27, 2011, 09:01:07 PM »

Protectoplate
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erikjohn
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« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2011, 09:01:36 PM »

Engine pad - The second character in the second portion looks like a T but it is actually a capital I which was interchangeable with a 1.  I couldn't upload a high engh quality pic to show where you could actually see the bottom of the I so it looks like a T in this pic.
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« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2011, 09:06:15 PM »

VIN
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« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2011, 09:06:49 PM »

Muncie 4 Spd
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« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2011, 09:07:15 PM »

Rear Axle
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« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2011, 09:14:40 PM »

The car
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tmodel66
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« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2011, 09:17:55 PM »

Simple enough the block is a restamp.
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Daniel  
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erikjohn
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« Reply #21 on: July 27, 2011, 09:28:26 PM »

Simple enough the block is a restamp.

Stay out of this thread please, you apparently have zero constructive advice to offer.
Thank you.
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« Reply #22 on: July 27, 2011, 09:36:22 PM »

EJ,

How much trouble would it be to remove the paint from the engine pad & post another pic?
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« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2011, 09:39:47 PM »

I have never seen a large journal 350 either.  I don't think they exist, and if they did as an experimental thing, it probably would have been right at the beginning of production - in September.  I wish I was closer to Orlando.  
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« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2011, 09:42:40 PM »

What is the casting number and casting date of the block?
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Jerry G.

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« Reply #25 on: July 27, 2011, 09:52:10 PM »

EJ,

How much trouble would it be to remove the paint from the engine pad & post another pic?

I can do that tomorrow, shouldn't be much of a big deal.  Is there something in particular that I should be looking for or trying to make sure is visible?

Getting the photo down to 150kb really makes it lose a lot of resolution but I do know for 100% that the block shows VI108MS which was confusing at first but I read that the capital letter I and the number one were used interchangeably on engine stamps it confirmed to me what I was seeing on my engine to be correct.
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« Reply #26 on: July 27, 2011, 09:53:52 PM »

I have never seen a large journal 350 either.  I don't think they exist, and if they did as an experimental thing, it probably would have been right at the beginning of production - in September.  I wish I was closer to Orlando. 

BC,
Mine has small journals, I assume that is what you meant.
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« Reply #27 on: July 27, 2011, 09:56:16 PM »

What is the casting number and casting date of the block?

Not sure I guess I need to get some photos of those casting numbers also.  I will look at them tomorrow and report back.  I will try to get pics if I can with the engine installed.
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« Reply #28 on: July 27, 2011, 10:07:08 PM »

Is there something in particular that I should be looking for or trying to make sure is visible?


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« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2011, 10:08:16 PM »

You only mention the main journals as being the smaller size.  How about the rod Journals?  Are they they the smaller size also?

Also I checked my July issue of the 1969 GM parts manual and there is only one part number for a 1967 & 1968 350ci crankshaft.  So if they ever did make a crankshaft with a small journal they never expected to replace it....they would have to replace the whole short block instead.

As to the engine pad.....did you repaint the pad when you rebuilt the engine?   The original engine pads from the factory were never painted.
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« Reply #30 on: July 27, 2011, 10:09:51 PM »

Cool, I will clean it off the paint with some mineral spirits and take some new photos.
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« Reply #31 on: July 27, 2011, 10:14:56 PM »

You only mention the main journals as being the smaller size.  How about the rod Journals?  Are they they the smaller size also?

Also I checked my July issue of the 1969 GM parts manual and there is only one part number for a 1967 & 1968 350ci crankshaft.  So if they ever did make a crankshaft with a small journal they never expected to replace it....they would have to replace the whole short block instead.

As to the engine pad.....did you repaint the pad when you rebuilt the engine?   The original engine pads from the factory were never painted.

Yeh, I repainted it chevy orange when I rebuilt it and painted over the numbers, didn't think twice about it at that time.  I don't remember the rod journals being a different size than was expected for a 350.  I had bought all of the bearing kit to rebuild a 350, the only ones that didn't work were the main bearings which I had to get a different part number(283-327 version).  Everything else was fine as far as I remember.
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« Reply #32 on: July 27, 2011, 10:25:29 PM »

Now that is strange....why would there be a crankshaft with large rod journals and small main journals.  About the only way that would happen is if they had a large journal crank with bad main journals and they then ground down the mains to the smaller size and stuck the crank in a 327ci block.  That would be a one of a kind animal.
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Jerry G.

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« Reply #33 on: July 28, 2011, 07:15:27 AM »

You could have been handed main bearings for a 400 SBC on accident when you got the rebuild kit.  Those would have been impossible to install on a 350 block/crank.  Without the original block, crank and original bearig shells "in hand", this discussion is not going to go very far. Clearly a 350 with 327 main bearings would be contrary to accepted "normative practice". 

-Mark.
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« Reply #34 on: July 28, 2011, 08:12:16 AM »

EJ - take another look at your engine stamp "V T 1 0 8 M S"...Now take a look at your Toe Plate Engine ID "V 1 1 0 8 M S". It's not looking good my friend...I can almost bet your broach marks are gone...

VT makes no sense at all. V=Flint & T=Tonawanda. It has to be one or the other.
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« Reply #35 on: July 28, 2011, 09:47:25 AM »

I've been building/rebuilding small-blocks for almost 50 years, and have never seen nor heard of a small-journal 350; will be interested to see the block casting number and date, and a good close-up of the pad (cleaned of paint). I'd think something  happened to this engine between 1967 and 1988.
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« Reply #36 on: July 28, 2011, 11:42:38 AM »

I'd bet when all the smoke clears its a big  journal  crank and the owner  may have just have it confused with another motor he may have rebuilt a long time ago.  It would have to be 1of 1 as nobody has ever heard of an orig small 350 crank. I owned an early 350 camaro in high school and just like everybody elses it was a big crank
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« Reply #37 on: July 28, 2011, 12:59:44 PM »

EJ,
  First thanks for the data you have posted, it always helps to see what you have. 
The revision date on that document you mentioned (Jan 1967) was because the L35 engine was added to the document, not because of a change to the L48.  I have a Chevy parts catalog dated Oct 1, 1966 and the 350 crank assembly listed has only one part number (3912355) and no cost listed.  This is the same assembly listed in the Chevy parts catalogue #691A for 67 and 68 350 engines.  I also have all of the 67 model year Chevy dealer service bulletins and they donít list any changes for the 350 crank.  I have all of the Chevy Service News publications for 67 and they donít show any changes to the 350 crank.
My 67 Camaroís engine code is V1209MV.  I have never had the bottom end apart, so I donít know what I have.  If I have a reason to take it apart, I will check into what the crank is, but I really donít expect anything different than what is listed as stock.
You can email me any pictures you like at the higher resolution.
Daniel
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« Reply #38 on: July 28, 2011, 01:18:25 PM »

Awesome thanks Daniel.

I am going to keep plugging away at this until I get it figured out.  As the one poster said it was 25 years ago that I had it apart so I may have misspoke on the rod journal bearings, but I just know that I had to put the smaller main journal bearings in and I am 100% sure it was this engine.  I will probably end up pulling apart the bottom end and start mic-ing stuff and looking for numbers.  I cleaned off the engine pad with some thinner.  See below.
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« Reply #39 on: July 28, 2011, 01:40:38 PM »

Thanks for taking the time to clean up & post the pad. It certainly isn't a restamp but what I thought was a "T" is indeed an "I" which either way still has me puzzled. There isn't a listing for this for an L48...or any other engine for that matter. http://www.camaros.org/drivetrain.shtml#PadStamps. Your engine has certainly peaked my interest.

Again...something is still amiss concerning your stamp as it relates to your POP. The POP indicates; V=Flint, 1108=Nov 8, MS=350ci/295HP L48 w/Manual Trans. Not really sure what the I means...
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« Reply #40 on: July 28, 2011, 02:00:40 PM »

Thanks for taking the time to clean up & post the pad. It certainly isn't a restamp but what I thought was a "T" is indeed an "I" which either way still has me puzzled. There isn't a listing for this for an L48...or any other engine for that matter. http://www.camaros.org/drivetrain.shtml#PadStamps. Your engine has certainly peaked my interest.

Again...something is still amiss concerning your stamp as it relates to your POP. The POP indicates; V=Flint, 1108=Nov 8, MS=350ci/295HP L48 w/Manual Trans. Not really sure what the I means...

From what I have read on the internet it was a very common occurrence for the stamp letter "I" to be used interchangeable with the stamp number "1" .

Here are a few links to the info but I also saw it elsewhere:
http://www.chevy-camaro.com/chevy-camaro-engine-suffix-code-help.asp

also a post by John Z on the camaro.net forum saying the same thing
http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=123269
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« Reply #41 on: July 28, 2011, 02:01:09 PM »

Here is the casting number:
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« Reply #42 on: July 28, 2011, 02:02:40 PM »

The engine date code.  This indicates it was cast on Nov 4th 1966
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« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2011, 02:12:48 PM »

From what I have read on the internet it was a very common occurrence for the stamp letter "I" to be used interchangeable with the stamp number "1" .

Here are a few links to the info but I also saw it elsewhere:
http://www.chevy-camaro.com/chevy-camaro-engine-suffix-code-help.asp

also a post by John Z on the camaro.net forum saying the same thing
http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=123269


Blew that idea right out of the water. Great pics thanks. Sounds more and more like your journals were switched.
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« Reply #44 on: July 28, 2011, 03:54:06 PM »

This is driving me crazy so I called my dad today as it was a father son rebuild type deal as I was like 14 at the time.  Anyway he set me straight a bit and informed me that it was the rod bearings that were smaller not the main bearings.  He said the main bearings were standard 350 size.   I must have not been there for this part of the rebuild when he tried to install the rod bearings the first time cause he said that when he tried to tighten up the rods he actually broke some of the bolts and ended up having to send all of the rods to the machine shop to have them resized after that to make sure there wasn't damage.

So I am looking at this link:

http://www.chevy-camaro.com/parts/chevy-camaro-part-codes-connect.htm

It says that all 1967 350's had the same size rod journal size as a 327.  It was made larger in 1968.  Apparently my engine is just the same as every other 1967-350.

Sorry for the confusion.
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« Reply #45 on: July 28, 2011, 04:22:01 PM »

 Smiley Wink Cheesy Grin Angry Sad Shocked Cool Huh Roll Eyes Tongue Embarrassed Lips Sealed Undecided Kiss Cry...All this from a 14yr old? What a vivid imagination...Welcome to CRG!
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« Reply #46 on: July 28, 2011, 04:27:07 PM »

According to all my sources there was only one 1967 350ci crankshaft and the specs are as follows:

   Rod journals   2.10 - otherwise known as the large journal  (Small journals were 2.00)
   Main journals  2.45 - otherwise known as the large journal  (Small Journals were 2.30)

This information was taken from the reference book entitled CHEVROLET By The Numbers written by Alan L. Colvin

So therefore there was not a crankshaft made with mixed small and large journals....they were either one way or the other.
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« Reply #47 on: July 28, 2011, 04:33:24 PM »

Right, what I meant was have not seen anything OTHER THAN a large journal 350.  Or have never seen a small journal 350.

I have never seen a large journal 350 either.  I don't think they exist, and if they did as an experimental thing, it probably would have been right at the beginning of production - in September.  I wish I was closer to Orlando. 

BC,
Mine has small journals, I assume that is what you meant.
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« Reply #48 on: July 28, 2011, 04:36:02 PM »

Smiley Wink Cheesy Grin Angry Sad Shocked Cool Huh Roll Eyes Tongue Embarrassed Lips Sealed Undecided Kiss Cry...All this from a 14yr old? What a vivid imagination...Welcome to CRG!

LOL Good to be here.  I guess I have had 25 years to get my story straight.  Car was given to me by my dad when I graduated college.  In high school I had my own 75 Camaro that I had built up a 350 - 4:10 posi with locking rear - Reprogrammed TH350 with 3000 stall etc and all the engine goodies.  This car is going to be my baby.  I drove it for a few years when I lived in Phoenix back in late 90's and stuck it into storage for last 10 years while I have been working on my shop.  Now I have a 2000sf shop in the back and me and my wife are going to start restoring this thing as a project together.  Currently searching for work so nothing is going to happen until that happens but with the extra time on my hands want to get this "small journal" mystery figured out.

Thanks guys that have bared with me.  Sorry again about the confusion.  Now what is this about no small rod journals, there seems to be some conflicting info floating around the internet.  Lets open that can of worms and see where it takes us cause I am still sticking with my story even though it has changed slightly.

EJ
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 04:53:37 PM by erikjohn » Logged

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« Reply #49 on: July 28, 2011, 06:21:15 PM »

...but with the extra time on my hands want to get this "small journal" mystery figured out.

...there seems to be some conflicting info floating around the internet.  Lets open that can of worms and see where it takes us cause I am still sticking with my story even though it has changed slightly.

EJ

I think we have tried to be as diplomatic as our patients will allow. A friendly word of advise, lets not open a can of worms..as far as I know this case IS closed. Conflicting info as you state comes from your source (reply 44). That site comes from an opportunistic individual from South America who has stolen much of his information from CRG. If the information isn't found here it doesn't exist...period!
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« Reply #50 on: July 28, 2011, 06:26:54 PM »

...but with the extra time on my hands want to get this "small journal" mystery figured out.

...there seems to be some conflicting info floating around the internet.  Lets open that can of worms and see where it takes us cause I am still sticking with my story even though it has changed slightly.

EJ

I think we have tried to be as diplomatic as our patients will allow. A friendly word of advise, lets not open a can of worms..as far as I know this case IS closed. Conflicting info as you state comes from your source (reply 44). That site comes from an opportunistic individual from South America who has stolen much of his information from CRG. If the information isn't found here it doesn't exist...period!

10-4 understood, I will move on with my venture which is not over for me.  Thanks for the insight and valuable information from all that have commented.  I was looking for people that would help me seek the truth about my car.  I have a matching numbers 350 that I was willing tear apart video tape and do whatever to figure out why when 25 years ago the journals were "small".  I guess that there is nothing more that I can gain from this because you are shutting me down on my quest.  I was hoping for some open mindedness even if I find out that I am wrong about my car.  All I have done to date is prove that the engine and the car are a match(which was also openly disputed).

All the best,
EJ
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 07:04:32 PM by erikjohn » Logged

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« Reply #51 on: July 29, 2011, 12:00:45 AM »

With due respect to Marty, his opinion does not represent the forum.
I'm still interested in the discussion. But I'm still a doubter.
Both bearing sizes changed with the SS350. By November, they had been making SS350's for months. To have one with the wrong bearings would not happen in a production enviroment. They were making engines, one after the other and all used the same components.
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« Reply #52 on: July 29, 2011, 06:23:35 AM »

Where in my response does it say I was representing anyone but IZRSSS? Since when does one persons opinion, other than core members, significantly impact an entire forum? This response was made by me and me alone and only represents my opinion. The point I was making is that I am satisfied with responses to this persons question/lament and as far as "I" am concerned, this topic no longer has any significance.
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« Reply #53 on: July 29, 2011, 09:53:19 PM »

EJ, as stated earlier there are different journal sizes.

"Small journal" SBC crankshafts are generally from 265, 283, and 327 engines up to about 1967. (excluding the 1967 350)
"Large journal" (sometimes called medium journal) SBC crankshafts started in about 1968. (again started in 67 with the 350).
"400 journal" cranshafts were used in the 400 cubic inch SBC engines starting about 1970.

Small journal is 2.00 rods and 2.30 mains.
Large journal is 2.10 rods and 2.45 mains.
400 journal is 2.10 rods and 2.65 mains.

EJ, just try not to sound so demanding when you are a relatively new poster on a site.  The people on this site are great and knowledgeable, but the patience level can drop when you seem to demand answers.
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« Reply #54 on: July 31, 2011, 02:26:10 PM »

There is one individual who without question has helped me more than anyone with my fact finding endeavors. It is hard even for me to find any justification for venting on him...because there isn't any. It speaks volumes of an individuals integrity, character, and restraint not to get caught up in meaningless argumentative conversations.  

EJ - I have spent countless hours reading information in CRG's archives, and countless threads/posts as they relate to the fledgling days of this site. Everyone has been in your shoes. In fact, I find many of these threads more entertaining than actual fact finding. It's refreshing to know that even the guys with the pretty gold stars were once prone to the same mistakes as the rest of us. I too came to this site with all cylinders firing ready to take on anyone who got in my way. I soon learned the information I possessed was more like a grain of sand in an ocean of knowledge. If there is any advise I can give you, spend some time on CRG's main page and the topic; "About the CRG". This will give you a sense of who the members are and the qualifications these gentlemen posses.

There are many, many other honorary members who never cease to amaze with their comand of the First Generation topic. Unfortunately, you can only learn to appreciate this by spending more time reviewing their posts. As for me, don't let the "H" word next to my name fool you. Although everyone else who has the "H" next to their name has earned it...for me, it simply indicates I have way too much spare time on my hands. Bottom line, I didn't mean to cut you off & good luck with your project.

Thanks bcmiller...    
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« Reply #55 on: August 01, 2011, 06:34:02 PM »

Sure, no problem Marty.  
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« Reply #56 on: August 01, 2011, 09:00:53 PM »

wow!! that car has changed some since I seen it last!!! If you have any pics of it back in the day post them!!!! When you get it done we will have to run it against my GN or the old 442!!! lol!
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« Reply #57 on: August 02, 2011, 02:28:26 PM »

Bottom line, I didn't mean to cut you off & good luck with your project.

Thanks bcmiller...     

No problem thanks guys for the explanation, sorry if I came across as demanding.  I think I am going to have to pull the pan and check what the crank and rod numbers are.  I can't remember though if I can do that without pulling the motor.

Does anyone know if the pan clear the crank past the cross member if I pull the bolts on the motor mounts and jack up the engine as far as the tranny will allow?

Thanks,
EJ
 
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« Reply #58 on: August 02, 2011, 02:39:02 PM »

Yes, you can get the pan off without pulling the engine.  I don't rmember what I had to do exactly, but I had my pan off several years ago.
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Daniel
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« Reply #59 on: August 02, 2011, 04:34:46 PM »

wow!! that car has changed some since I seen it last!!! If you have any pics of it back in the day post them!!!! When you get it done we will have to run it against my GN or the old 442!!! lol!

Yeh, it's been 20 years since you saw it.  It still runs like a champ.  I have put about 20k miles on it though since then when I was driving it back in the late 90's as my main vehicle (wtf).
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« Reply #60 on: August 03, 2011, 11:36:30 AM »

Does anyone know if the pan clear the crank past the cross member if I pull the bolts on the motor mounts and jack up the engine as far as the tranny will allow?

Thanks,
EJ
 

Pull the distributor, remove the fan, drain the oil and coolant and disconnect the upper and lower radiator hoses, remove the engine mount through-bolts, loosen the trans mount bolts, jack the engine up and stuff a piece of 2x4 between the frame stands and engine-side mounts. Set the engine with the timing index line on the balancer at 5 o'clock as viewed from the front (gets the front counterweight up out of the way for more clearance), and remove the pan.
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« Reply #61 on: August 03, 2011, 03:23:42 PM »

Does anyone know if the pan clear the crank past the cross member if I pull the bolts on the motor mounts and jack up the engine as far as the tranny will allow?

Thanks,
EJ
 

Pull the distributor, remove the fan, drain the oil and coolant and disconnect the upper and lower radiator hoses, remove the engine mount through-bolts, loosen the trans mount bolts, jack the engine up and stuff a piece of 2x4 between the frame stands and engine-side mounts. Set the engine with the timing index line on the balancer at 5 o'clock as viewed from the front (gets the front counterweight up out of the way for more clearance), and remove the pan.

Perfect!  That's the plan then.  Thanks John.
EJ
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« Reply #62 on: August 03, 2011, 04:33:33 PM »

Just curious since you have the POP have you tried contacting the original owner?  He may not be able to verify any of the information you are looking for but it can't hurt.  The guy I work next to is from Waverly IA and recognized the name when I asked him.  He is thinking the son is also named Rod and around 40 yrs old which means the dad would have been prime age to buy a new '67 Camaro.  Again just curious.  This was quite an interesting thread.  Best of luck!

Dave
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« Reply #63 on: August 03, 2011, 06:12:18 PM »

Just curious since you have the POP have you tried contacting the original owner?  He may not be able to verify any of the information you are looking for but it can't hurt.  The guy I work next to is from Waverly IA and recognized the name when I asked him.  He is thinking the son is also named Rod and around 40 yrs old which means the dad would have been prime age to buy a new '67 Camaro.  Again just curious.  This was quite an interesting thread.  Best of luck!

Dave

I have but when I googled the name and tried to find info online I didn't get anywhere.  If there is any info or contact info you or your friend feels comfortable sharing PM me and I will follow up!  Awesome.
Thanks!
EJ
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« Reply #64 on: August 04, 2011, 10:04:32 AM »

Sorry he doesn't have any contact info.  I tried Intelius.com and found a possible hit for both a person in their 60's and also their 40's.  Neither in Waverly but one had some very close towns.  Give it a shot.  Wish I could be more help.
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« Reply #65 on: August 26, 2011, 11:18:17 AM »

Hello,
I was employed at Performance Machine in San Luis Obispo California back in the 70's as a crank grinder.   I recall seeing at least two small journal 350 crankshaft that came from 67 Camaro's. Unfortunately I cannot find my book with the forging numbers in it. But I can validate that one of these came from a co-workers 67 SS-350 which I was familiar with and believe was a fairly early production as it did not have the traction bar on the rear end.  This small journal 350  crank hung hung on the rack the entire time I worked there as no one wanted the small journal cranks that would not fit the 4 bolt main blocks.  During my time there and since then I have I have collected many crankshafts.  The one that I find the most interesting is a cast iron 283 crank with a notch in the flange like 302's have and some steel 283's have.  I bet this will start some discussion! I can post photos.  Is there any information on this site about the special 67 SS-350 dimpled connecting rods.
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« Reply #66 on: August 28, 2011, 02:31:18 PM »

>>erikjohn,,,I can relate to your frustration.  I posted on here, I have a complete matching set of Date correct matching Robbins Seat Belts for my 67 Camaro.  I was told Robbins were never put in Camaros.  I believe there was only one owner before this car was purchased by my brother in mid 80's.   Why would anyone have changed a complete set and made sure they were date correct?
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1967 Camaro  LOS  11A
Original Engine   Z - Tribute
Mike C.    NW - Illinois
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