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tmodel66
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« on: December 07, 2010, 12:01:21 PM »

Please help me make sure I have everything correct before paint. 

Suede paint on top of the dash and all the area trim around the package tray.

Lower front dash where glove box is all this gets Satin finish.

Is there anywhere I am missing?      Is this paint scheme correct?
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Daniel  
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tmodel66
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« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2010, 09:19:28 PM »

Can anybody help with this? Huh
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Daniel  
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« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2010, 12:48:41 PM »

The metal garnish moldings around the back window and package tray area on my all-original 02D '69 aren't suede - they're just low-gloss paint (like the lower instrument panel area). Only the upper instrument panel forward of the dash pad is suede. You didn't mention what year yours is.
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william
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« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2010, 12:58:07 PM »

My refinishing info states the following are suede: upper instrument panel, auxiliary speaker grille, rear window defogger grille, back window lower garnish.
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tmodel66
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« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2010, 02:24:00 PM »

It's a '69 and I always forget to put that into a post.   Thanks for all the information.
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Daniel  
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« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2010, 12:08:45 PM »

<<My refinishing info states the following are suede: upper instrument panel, auxiliary speaker grille, rear window defogger grille, back window lower garnish.>>

Photo below of my original rear defogger grille and lower garnish molding; neither is suede - just medium gloss.
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KurtS
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« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2010, 12:46:29 AM »

I've never seen any rear window piece in suede.
Just the front dash.
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Kurt S
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« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2010, 12:22:32 PM »

My original 1969 with blue interior has the sued around the package tray below the rear glass, and a friends unrestored 69 Z has the (black) sued also.
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KurtS
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« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2010, 04:08:58 PM »

Let's see some pics. My cars and spare parts all look like John's.
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Kurt S
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« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2010, 04:57:23 PM »

John & Kurt,

I am still trying to figure out the difference between "Suede & Med Gloss". Is suede similar to satin? Not sure what this is painted but it sure looks like med gloss, similar to yours John.
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Sauron327
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« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2010, 05:21:39 PM »

Various gloss levels are achieved by different amounts of flattening agent added to the paint. Texture is the result of a different additive. For example: PPG's texture additive is DX 1999. When you pull up a formula, you grab the tints off the machine and mix the paint. Texture can also be achieved simply by under reducing and dry spraying. Over reducing paint also alters gloss levels. A survivor and not the victim of deterioration and age is good reference.  Cars with repainted interiors are often done incorrectly.
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« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2010, 07:07:18 PM »

Thanks for the information Sauron. I think I'll file your post for future reference. By looking at mine...is it right or wrong... or is it difficult to tell?
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lakeholme
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« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2010, 12:54:16 PM »

Marty,

Sent you a PM.
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Phillip
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« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2010, 03:48:36 PM »

Thanks Phillip...
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Sauron327
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« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2010, 05:50:40 PM »

Thanks for the information Sauron. I think I'll file your post for future reference. By looking at mine...is it right or wrong... or is it difficult to tell?
Sheens are sometimes difficult to evaluate on screen. Try comparing to other pics on this site. SEM Trim Black is close to the original 9266 code. We always had a 9266 gallon pre mixed on the machine as it was used often.
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paceme
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« Reply #15 on: December 17, 2010, 09:31:57 PM »

Based on the unrestored original car I have inspected/certified, the finish on the package tray trim is a  suede finish like the dash.
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tmodel66
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« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2010, 01:42:39 PM »

According to Larry Christensen the package tray area was suede from the factory.
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Daniel  
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« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2010, 01:41:30 PM »

According to Larry Christensen the package tray area was suede from the factory.

Clearly, it varied somewhat - my untouched/original '69 has no trace of the "suede" texture anywhere around the back window and package tray area.
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william
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« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2010, 02:36:53 PM »

Suede deteriorates over time; 40 years is a lot of it. I had rattle cans of it mixed locally and recall spraying a portion of the dash on a parts car. It was a perfect match-to the area under the dash pad. Exposed areas of the same surface were weathered and looked smoother.
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big iron
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« Reply #19 on: February 29, 2012, 12:51:32 PM »

Could you not take a picture of an original car survivor's dash, which is supposed to be suede, and rear garnish area and settle this issue? The pictures would have to be taken with the same light, natural preferred, and camera.
Both areas would have had the same exposure so any difference would indicate a difference in surface finish.
Bob
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69Z28-RS
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« Reply #20 on: February 29, 2012, 02:23:35 PM »

What do you fellas mean by 'suede' paint?   Are you referring to a 'flat'  or 'semi-flat' finish?  with ie. low light reflection? 
I don't think I've ever heard the 'suede' term used previously (in 45 yrs or so) referring to automotive finishes.   Are there GM documents that use the suede term re '69 camaros??
I do recall when I purchased my '69 Camaro in '76, the first time I cleaned my rear glass on the inside, I *noticed* that the paint on the lower garnish moulding was more flat than anything I'd seen previously on a car I'd owned.   That same car has been sitting in my basement garage since 1980, and I don'[t recall 'cleaning' the inside of the back glass in that time..  if I have, it's only been once or twice.. Smiley    so it should still be close to the same.   I've pushed the car out a half dozen times in those 30+ year since to wash it on the outside.. and wiped it down on the inside maybe 2 or 3 times.   I can take a photo tonight if it would halp, but I can't guarantee the light level..?

Gary  / 69 Z28-RS
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« Reply #21 on: February 29, 2012, 02:35:08 PM »

OK, here's my thought.  If the trim around the package tray is painted suede, and I don't believe it was, where does it change over.  Because the upper side trim is not suede, it is same as Dash face.
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« Reply #22 on: February 29, 2012, 04:02:47 PM »

Agreed. It could absolutely not happen on a '67 due to the fact that the interior panels do not cover the upper area which gets painted. On a '68 or '69, the rear interior panel would cover the top painted area and theoretically some transition to suede paint texture could have been made under there. However, I'm of the belief that suede paint was only used on the upper dash, forward of the dash pad.
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tmodel66
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« Reply #23 on: February 29, 2012, 04:29:58 PM »

 Look at this paint chart. It says low gloss and gives the specific places to be painted. Then below it list "O" gloss and gives the specific areas. That's what I went by when I painted my car.  Hover over the writing and it will magnify so you can read it.

http://www.tcpglobal.com/autocolorlibrary/aclchip.aspx?image=1969-chevrolet-pg02.jpg
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Daniel  
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Sauron327
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« Reply #24 on: February 29, 2012, 04:49:01 PM »

What do you fellas mean by 'suede' paint?   Are you referring to a 'flat'  or 'semi-flat' finish?  with ie. low light reflection?  
If using PPG, it's accomplished by adding DX1999(texture additive) and flattening agent to the paint. You can also under reduce flattened paint, and use a dry spray technique to achieve a similar result.
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big iron
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« Reply #25 on: February 29, 2012, 05:07:09 PM »

Most of the suede questions are coming from the 69 owners but 68 owners may have doubts as well.
An original 68 could have pictures taken as well to clear up any possible issues.
Suede is more than a flat color. I believe that when applied the finish is irregular, something like pebble Gran on interior parts, so the light does not reflect directly back onto the windshield. Something like the surfaces of our stealth bombers.
Bob
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tmodel66
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« Reply #26 on: February 29, 2012, 05:17:30 PM »

Most of the suede questions are coming from the 69 owners but 68 owners may have doubts as well.
An original 68 could have pictures taken as well to clear up any possible issues.
Suede is more than a flat color. I believe that when applied the finish is irregular, something like pebble Gran on interior parts, so the light does not reflect directly back onto the windshield. Something like the surfaces of our stealth bombers.
Bob

OK here's the '68 paint chart and has the same areas listed for different gloss.

http://www.tcpglobal.com/autocolorlibrary/aclchip.aspx?image=1968-chevrolet-pg02.jpg
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Daniel  
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big iron
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« Reply #27 on: February 29, 2012, 07:10:46 PM »

Daniel,
Unfortunately the paint charts shown are generic for Chevrolet and do not cover specific models except for the 68 textured finish.
Being generic the charts only lead to confusion when trying to figure out what part and body style gets painted what % of gloss.
Looking at similar original car with the same approximate build date is the only way to hopefully know what is correct.
Bob
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tmodel66
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« Reply #28 on: February 29, 2012, 07:38:03 PM »

I guess I read too much into it. I figured it would have been across the board on run of the mill cars.
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Daniel  
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« Reply #29 on: March 01, 2012, 01:56:32 AM »

I checked my original car tonight; the garnish around / below the rear window is as I remembered..   flat, but not 'velvety' or 'suedy'..  (whatever that means), but it is flat enough that where it is touched it will leave 'shiny spots' which is a characteristic of very flat finishes.  I took photographs, but they are too large to post here, so I'll have to reduce resolution and size or retake the photo.

I would describe the finish as 'semi-flat black'....

Gary
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« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2012, 06:46:27 PM »

Here are pics of my 9800 mile unrestored 6 cylinder car. It is a suede type finish that looks the same as the dash.
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Charley
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« Reply #31 on: March 01, 2012, 06:54:37 PM »

I posted bigger pics on Yenko.net so you can see the finish better.   http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=482559&#Post482559

and another thread on the car to give you background on how orig it is.

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=457136&page=1
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-vellu
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« Reply #32 on: January 12, 2014, 02:55:45 PM »

Old topic, but I add my own work here.

Not Package Tray Paint, but maybe the same output. I used Eastwood Trunk Paint Aerosol. Just very thin single layer. (I tried this for the trunk, but it was not good enough for that purpose). The pattern is very low and therefore it did not fit to the trunk paint so good.



When it was dry, I painted basic matte black on top of it.



I think the result is acceptable. What do you guys think?
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janobyte
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« Reply #33 on: January 12, 2014, 03:30:19 PM »

mmm--mines been untouched and  appears low gloss, not flat by no means but non reflective. no texture. Actually a very smooth finish. Opinions may vary but been with this car 38 years and know the other owners.
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Sauron327
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« Reply #34 on: January 12, 2014, 04:13:39 PM »

Old topic, but I add my own work here.

Not Package Tray Paint, but maybe the same output. I used Eastwood Trunk Paint Aerosol. Just very thin single layer. (I tried this for the trunk, but it was not good enough for that purpose). The pattern is very low and therefore it did not fit to the trunk paint so good.

When it was dry, I painted basic matte black on top of it.

I think the result is acceptable. What do you guys think?

Too much texture. Use SEM Texture Coating, have your jobber mix up the paint using the code which has the correct texture additive, or duplicate using dry spray technique.
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jims69
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« Reply #35 on: January 12, 2014, 08:44:29 PM »

My cousin's new 1969 SS never had suede on the rear window garnish moldings.   I remember it very well; we washed the car and the windows (inside and out) many times for rides in the car.   My 69 doesn't have it in the rear either; (its kind of a low gloss black)   or on the auxiliary speaker grill, and I've owned it for 38 years.

Some car's must have  received the suede treatment from  Charley's picture of his car.   It would be interesting to see someone research the subject.

Jim
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-vellu
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« Reply #36 on: January 13, 2014, 01:41:29 AM »

Old topic, but I add my own work here.

Not Package Tray Paint, but maybe the same output. I used Eastwood Trunk Paint Aerosol. Just very thin single layer. (I tried this for the trunk, but it was not good enough for that purpose). The pattern is very low and therefore it did not fit to the trunk paint so good.

When it was dry, I painted basic matte black on top of it.

I think the result is acceptable. What do you guys think?

Too much texture. Use SEM Texture Coating, have your jobber mix up the paint using the code which has the correct texture additive, or duplicate using dry spray technique.

You are right. I need to sand it and try SEM Texture Coating.
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dlaflamme
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« Reply #37 on: June 07, 2014, 10:32:40 PM »

First off, hello - I'm a newb here.  I'm restoring my 68 RS/SS 350 matching numbers car I've owned for 25 years.  It's a Norwood car that lived its first 15 years or so in Pennsylvania, so unfortunately I'm having to replace a lot of body rot and other unsalvageable parts. I found this thread while I was looking for what to apply gloss/semi/dull/flat black paints to across the board (under hood, interior, etc)....still trying to find a comprehensive list of what parts over these cars have which finish of black.  Steve's Camaros has a list for under hood but I like to research CRG as a best source.  Not sure I trust Classic Industries' list with each finish they have, as it seems a bit flippant.

Related to this thread, thought I'd post two pics of my glovebox door, which I BELIEVE is unmolested.  Hope it helps someone with the suede discussion, which is a new finish name to me.  I'm not a paint guy, but will be bringing this door to my painter to match for the dashboard - which I've always known to be a smooth finish, a sort of semi dull, semi-gloss smooth black finish.  I have no proof this hasn't been repainted, but since I appear to have the original tire PSI sticker, I think it's original paint.  Hoping I can salvage the sticker, although I'm concerned about blue/green tape damaging it...maybe it's not such a big deal but it is the only original factory applied sticker and I'd prefer to keep it (assumption by its appearance and the fact it's in the glovebox where it's protected).

Someone said to take pics in different light, which I'm happy to do for anyone, while i still have it as it sits.  these are under run of the mill garage fluorescents, and I intended to try to show the lights reflecting from parts of it, thinking that might help?  Hope these can help someone on the topic of dashboard finish.

To my original reason for finding this thread....does anyone know of a list or thread that has a definitive listing of black finish for black parts?  RS headlamp door assembly, headlight cups, pedal assemblies, and all other parts that are painted any style of black?  I made the assumption there was a reference guide before I started sandblasting a lot of these things down to bare metal...car has been painted at least 3 times, so I had a lot of overspray to remove.  Kicking myself I didn't make better notes while I stare down the various types of OER paint I planned to use on some of these pieces!  It's not a concourse restoration, but since I'm going to bare metal on every piece, I do want to try to stay as true to the car's history as I can.

PS- the filesize limit is making me decrease the size.  PM me at dlaflamme@cox.net if you want the full size pic.
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firstgenaddict
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« Reply #38 on: June 08, 2014, 11:21:31 AM »

Another Suede sample for the discussion...
12C X66 Conv Header Drivers side has a heavy texture pass side overspray is only semi gloss or straight lacquer.





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James
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JohnZ
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« Reply #39 on: June 08, 2014, 12:50:36 PM »

Related to this thread, thought I'd post two pics of my glovebox door, which I BELIEVE is unmolested.  Hope it helps someone with the suede discussion, which is a new finish name to me.  I'm not a paint guy, but will be bringing this door to my painter to match for the dashboard - which I've always known to be a smooth finish, a sort of semi dull, semi-gloss smooth black finish.  I have no proof this hasn't been repainted, but since I appear to have the original tire PSI sticker, I think it's original paint.  Hoping I can salvage the sticker, although I'm concerned about blue/green tape damaging it...maybe it's not such a big deal but it is the only original factory applied sticker and I'd prefer to keep it (assumption by its appearance and the fact it's in the glovebox where it's protected).

The glove box door isn't part of the "suede" finish discussion. The glove box door was a Chevrolet part, and was flow-coated in black primer, baked, and then painted interior lacquer color and baked again prior to installation to the previously Fisher Body-painted steel instrument panel, which was a frequent color-match problem.
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