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| | |-+  1969 BLACK 396 cars got a different black tail panel paint than the body
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Author Topic: 1969 BLACK 396 cars got a different black tail panel paint than the body  (Read 5528 times)
black69
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« on: November 22, 2010, 02:55:51 AM »

Ok, so I know some folks thought I was nutts, saying my survivor paint black 69 L78 has a black painted tail that is a different paint than the body.

So I went and checked the black survivor paint 1969 427 baldwin motion camaro at the muscle car nationals this weekend (a car converted from a L78), and it was like looking at the same car as mine.

The paint masking marks that run at a 45 degree angle inside the trunk opening area were clearer on that car than mine. There were other details around the tail lights that indicated there were 2 different paints used.  I showed it to the original owner of the car, and his nephew (who owns it now), and they agreed 100% with me that it was painted, and their words were it was a different duller black than the body paint.

What was also interesting, was the sheer amount of orange peal on the bulk of the tail panel on the flat surface between the tail lights.  It was EXACTLY the same as on my car.  Both our cars have non orange peal trunk lids, D80 spoilers, but the tail panels look really different in terms of paint texture (rivers of orange peal, no drips though).  

The car's VIN is in the 600K range, mine is in the 656K range, so they are a fair amount apart to say this did not just happen in one week of production. Both are Norwood cars.

The car has the same red hockey stripe paint and sticker attributes as my car too.  The stencil used for the painted stripe left behind small tic marks ever inch or so, and that was neat to see (only some original paint cars will show this).

I think it would be of reasonable consideration to now say black ss 396 cars got their tail panels painted following the standard process.
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triple black 69L78 red hockey stripe
KurtS
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« Reply #1 on: November 22, 2010, 03:33:10 PM »

I didn't think you were nuts. I just haven't had the time to follow up on this. And finding another original paint car was the big follow-up. Great that you were able to find one.
I've talked with several people who have repainted black SS396 cars and said there was no black tail panel paint. The difficulty in seeing the tape line shows why they thought there wasn't a black-out treatment.
Do you have a pic or two of that car's black-out?
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Kurt S
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black69
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« Reply #2 on: November 22, 2010, 05:48:57 PM »

Kurt, I did not have the right camera to take the picture and it was not good timing for the baldwin motion display of that guys car (Joel rosen was in the area).

I asked one of the guys over at super car work shop to go look at it to vindicate, as well as Darryn costello (one of the camaro judges). Darryn has seen this on my car so I hoped he could go check it out. Darryn actually pointed out to me how the line shows up inside the lip (on the other side of the rubber seal) if you look for it.  I figured with the vintage certification of the car, this would have gotten discovered, so maybe steve s has some vintage certification pictures. 

I hope to get a picture from the owner of the other car when he gets it home. He 'owes me' because my recommendation of using black turtle wax made his car look great Smiley 

Here is mine while we work on getting a good picture of his.  Natural sunlight really helps show the difference, over flouresent lighting.

-bob

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maroman
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« Reply #3 on: November 22, 2010, 06:21:37 PM »

I see a milky line at about a 45 degree angle, is that what you mean? Could it be enamal paint for the rear panel over lacquer body paint?
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Doug  '67 RS/SS 396 auto I know the car since new
Charley
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« Reply #4 on: November 22, 2010, 10:40:43 PM »

Crap..I was there and didn't think to look at it. Did you look at the low mile green L78 in the Vintage certification area ? I will post pics when I get them downsized.The gloss in your pic looks the same. Very glossy, not satin or semi. Just a tiny bit duller than full gloss.
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JohnZ
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« Reply #5 on: November 23, 2010, 01:40:11 PM »

Could it be enamal paint for the rear panel over lacquer body paint?

The only enamel paint in the plant was for the wheels; everything else was lacquer.
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black69
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« Reply #6 on: November 23, 2010, 02:52:26 PM »

Charley, I wish you could have gone and looked at that black car too.  I saw that green 67 car (this is when I asked the SCWs folks looking at it to go look at the black car).  

I looked at that car, and what appeared different between that non 69 car and the 2 black 69s was the amount of orange peel.  

I think for now, I have 2 nails ready to go in the coffin for the painted tail panel topic for a black car.  But here is a another potential nail to consider (orange peel cound prove a second coat was applied?):

Orange peel is defined as 'too much paint' or 'non ideal painting technique' if you look at the definition of that term.  These 2 black cars I am refering to have it pretty bad, there has to be an explanation for it (my speculation there is a second full paint coat).  

As a side note: If I were a judge of an original paint car, and it landed between a 600K to 660K VIN, I would expect to see some form of orange peel on the tail for a SS 396 car.  I would ponder if I did not see it. Its like once you see the defects left behind on a hockey stripe done with an original stencil. Once you see that, you wonder about cars you don't see it on. That other black car made 60K units before mine, had all the same stripe aspects which was so cool to see.





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black69
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« Reply #7 on: November 23, 2010, 02:54:28 PM »

I see a milky line at about a 45 degree angle, is that what you mean?

Yes! join my fan club!
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maroman
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« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2010, 05:35:55 PM »

Thanks John. That eliminates that idea.
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Doug  '67 RS/SS 396 auto I know the car since new
Charley
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« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2010, 06:07:12 PM »

green 68 L78 with 15K miles...Amazing car.
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Charley
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« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2010, 06:09:22 PM »

last pic was for another subject. It just shows green paint showing the car was painted with the floor plugs in.
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paceme
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« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2010, 08:44:35 PM »

Regarding the Black Motion car, we Vintage Certified the car in 2009 and found that the tail panel had the same 80% glossed paint applied as found on all 396 Camaros.  

BTW the green 68 rs/ss L78 has led a pampered life and was as original and well preserved as it gets. Really just a stunning car. Take notice it's a stripe delete car.  
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Steve Shauger
Vintage Certification™ Program, Providing Recognition And Status To Unrestored Vehicles. Website www.vintagecertification.com
black69
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« Reply #12 on: November 24, 2010, 12:10:46 AM »

Here is a picture of my car, that shows the paint difference relative to the body.  It only shows this tone difference in direct sunlight (which is how I discovered all of this in the first place).  Get the car out of direct sunlight beating down on it, and it just goes un-noticed, and it blends in perfectly with the black body paint. Somebody has to know what that paint mix formula is.



my car



here's a picture of the tail of the baldwin car, care of someone else.  I have more photos on my new phone and will post once I download them (they show just the orange peel, did not get the paint shadow lines). 



« Last Edit: November 24, 2010, 01:20:07 AM by black69 » Logged

triple black 69L78 red hockey stripe
firstgenaddict
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« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2011, 12:45:32 PM »

Exactly how may different blacks were there in the booth where the Tail pan was painted?
Someone please add or correct if I am wrong here...
This would have been done in the Touch up booth, correct?
1. Code 10 gloss black exterior body color
2. Interior Semi gloss
3. Interior suede
4. black out paint for firewall


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James
Collectin' Camaro's since "Only Rednecks drove them"
 
Check out the Black 69 RS/Z28 45k mile Survivor and the Lemans Blue 69 Z 10D frame off...
https://picasaweb.google.com/112392262205377424364/1969_Z28_Restoration
JohnZ
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« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2011, 11:56:05 AM »

Exactly how may different blacks were there in the booth where the Tail pan was painted?
Someone please add or correct if I am wrong here...
This would have been done in the Touch up booth, correct?
1. Code 10 gloss black exterior body color
2. Interior Semi gloss
3. Interior suede
4. black out paint for firewall




#4 was also used for Z-21 rocker panel blackout, and most likely for BB tail panels too.
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'69 Z/28
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