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Author Topic: Fisher Body Paint Shop  (Read 15341 times)
Mark
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« Reply #15 on: December 24, 2008, 07:08:58 AM »

That red car is an LA built car isn't it.  They were on an overhead rack when they got painted so they were higher off the ground then a Norwood built car which was sitting on a truck on the ground when it was painted.  Hence they got more primer and body color overspray on the undercarraige of the car then a Norwood built car would.
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Mark C.
1969 Indy Pace Car
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Buddy
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hurcousa
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« Reply #16 on: December 24, 2008, 12:18:08 PM »

The assembly process states that primer was the first paint coat on the car. There is a Phosphate stage before prime, did this create the Dark color in the pic? What color did the phosphate stage turn the bare metal?

Buddy
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firstgenaddict
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« Reply #17 on: December 24, 2008, 01:31:28 PM »

The assembly process states that primer was the first paint coat on the car. There is a Phosphate stage before prime, did this create the Dark color in the pic? What color did the phosphate stage turn the bare metal?

Buddy

I believe it is flowcoat primer which is the same color as the inner fenders, rad support, etc!
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James
Collectin' Camaro's since "Only Rednecks drove them"
 
Check out the Black 69 RS/Z28 45k mile Survivor and the Lemans Blue 69 Z 10D frame off...
https://picasaweb.google.com/112392262205377424364/1969_Z28_Restoration
Buddy
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« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2008, 02:31:58 PM »

The Assembly process doc does not state this? Whats up?

Buddy
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JohnZ
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« Reply #19 on: December 26, 2008, 10:28:42 AM »

The Assembly process doc does not state this? Whats up?

Buddy

The body shell (at Fisher Body) and the front sheet metal (at Chevrolet) were primed differently. In both cases, when the body (or sheet metal) left the pre-clean and phosphate system, it was a natural steel color (light silvery gray). The body was spray-primed with red oxide primer, followed by primer-surfacers, then color. The Chevrolet front sheet metal was dip-primed (or flow-coated) with black primer, then sprayed with primer-surfacer, then color (as described in the Chevrolet Paint Shop section of the Assembly Process paper). The Fisher Body Paint Shop section describes how the body shell (from the firewall back) was painted, and the Chevrolet Paint Shop section describes how the front sheet metal was painted.
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'69 Z/28
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Buddy
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hurcousa
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« Reply #20 on: December 26, 2008, 12:52:20 PM »

That is exactly what I read. So, Why is there black with the red oxide under the car?HuhHuhHuhHuh?

Process=

1. Cleaned (raw metal}
2. Phosphate (grayish raw metal}
3. Primer (red oxide)
4. Primer surfacer (Gray)
5. Body Color (red in this case)

There is no black here?HuhHuh
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redge
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« Reply #21 on: December 27, 2008, 12:58:59 PM »

Hi , my 69 made in norwood was light gray primer for the body shell and doors , no trace of red oxide primer , and the front fender was black primer under the orange paint , that prove the car was originally paint in two different place , body in fisher and front clip at norwood HuhHuh correct me JohnZ if i am wrong
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Buddy
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hurcousa
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« Reply #22 on: December 28, 2008, 08:17:20 PM »

I am talking about a 67 Camaro LOS car.  Can anyone here answer this?

Thx
Buddy
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firstgenaddict
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« Reply #23 on: December 28, 2008, 08:31:19 PM »

What month production is your car?
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James
Collectin' Camaro's since "Only Rednecks drove them"
 
Check out the Black 69 RS/Z28 45k mile Survivor and the Lemans Blue 69 Z 10D frame off...
https://picasaweb.google.com/112392262205377424364/1969_Z28_Restoration
Buddy
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hurcousa
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« Reply #24 on: December 29, 2008, 09:29:09 AM »

February...thx
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firstgenaddict
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« Reply #25 on: December 29, 2008, 09:44:59 AM »

Who knows...
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James
Collectin' Camaro's since "Only Rednecks drove them"
 
Check out the Black 69 RS/Z28 45k mile Survivor and the Lemans Blue 69 Z 10D frame off...
https://picasaweb.google.com/112392262205377424364/1969_Z28_Restoration
rat pack
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« Reply #26 on: December 29, 2008, 10:36:48 AM »

Buddy, I have been researching this topic for years, but had put it on the back-burner for other topics until I read this post. Personally I have yet to see any 67 built in the LOS plant using red oxide primer as its base prime coat, and very few NOR built cars until 1969. What you are seeing in the picture of the floors on the car at Team Camaro is the body color overspray and not red oxide primer. I just sold an 01C LOS car that was red and the floors looked just like this one, covered in red body color not red oxide primer. The primers on that car were all greys: dark grey (black) base prime, with lt.grey being the topcoat sealer. Why I think most would think that this is red oxide primer is that when the red overspray of the body color hits the darker gray it will turn it an orangish/brown color from where it bites into the undercoat.  If the owner of that car waxed those red areas he would find it is body color. Red is the hardest body color to distinguish from red oxide primer in 67 & 68 is those reds had an orange tint to them more than the 69 Garnet Red.

As Mark stated above, usually the overspray on the floorpans of the LOS cars was heavy as compared to the NOR built cars, so the picture of the car on Team Camaro can be confusing. Another good place to look for the primer overspray is in the shock tower area. The picture below is from the 67 I am restoring now, it is an LOS built car and no red oxide primer used at any time. Take some pictures of the underside of your package tray area, but set your flash to use the "red eye" reducer so you do not get any harsh light reflections.  Doing this should show you the colors of primers used on your car. I had always thought that the topcoat sealer color had something to do with the final color of the car, and I am still leaving that option open. The first cars I have found with red oxide or "ruddy brown" primer/sealers to be predominantly used were in 69, but I have seen just as many with dark grey/black.  I do not totally agree with John's statement in the article that red oxide was the base primer, at least not for all years and both plants. I have seen more cars with dark grey (black) than any other color for its base primer in the first gen Camaros. 

To answer your latest question, the dark color is the primer surfacer first applied after the phosphating is done. What color is your car? Also what is the exact build date 02? ....................RatPack.............................

*** Anyone with an urestored car that has not had any restoration work to the undercarriage or floors other than being washed,  I would like some pictures for a future CRG article regarding this topic. Please send me a private message and I will give you my email address where to send the pictures to. All years of 1st gens are wanted, including Firebirds.





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firstgenaddict
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« Reply #27 on: December 29, 2008, 12:14:10 PM »

Can you take a good clear photo of a few of the drain plugs from the bottom? If they are dirty please clean them but do not take off any overspray if there is any...
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James
Collectin' Camaro's since "Only Rednecks drove them"
 
Check out the Black 69 RS/Z28 45k mile Survivor and the Lemans Blue 69 Z 10D frame off...
https://picasaweb.google.com/112392262205377424364/1969_Z28_Restoration
Buddy
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hurcousa
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« Reply #28 on: December 29, 2008, 06:18:51 PM »

FINALLY...Thank you  so much everyone for your help..it seems like it has taken forever to figure this out. DP90 should do the trick don't you think?

02B Madeira Maroon N-N..I will attach my Trim Tag

Yee Haw!!!

Thx
Buddy
« Last Edit: December 29, 2008, 06:28:29 PM by Buddy » Logged
rat pack
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« Reply #29 on: December 29, 2008, 06:43:47 PM »

Yep DP90 is a good choice for durability and it is self-etching which eliminates a step. Be sure to do any bodywork that you need to before spraying that DP90.  We used DP90 on the bottom of the car I am doing now right after it was media blasted. Did the bodywork on the few dents and rust pits, then topcoated it with a sealer from Martin-Senour. I don't have the number off hand but I am heading to the body shop right now and I will get if for you later tonight. It dries to an eggshell finish and is waterproof once it hardens, unlike most primers. Good luck with your car!!!...........RatPack..........

Firstgen, done removed the drain plugs, but they were installed before the car was painted, they did have white/tan/orangish colored body sealant, they had lots of overspray on the inside of the car and some on the outside. My 68 was the same way. I think I have some pictures of them from inside the car, none from outside that I know of.....sorry.............

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