New guy, New project ' 67

[MooneyDriver]

Checking in! A few weeks ago I bought my second GM vehicle ever, and its a 1967 Camaro, pretty nice shape, Im 4th owner, been on the west coast all its life, 327, th350, minimal rust, been painted once, a very long time ago it looks.  Guy I got it from drove it into his garage and took it apart, and never did anything but buy parts for it.  Im pretty excited.  Quarters will be here any day, it already had a cowl hood, new decklid, new dash piece, new rear back panel, new front upper piece, battery tray..

Ive order a new radiator core support, drip rails, quarter skins, front chin spoiler.. Probably end up buying a new roof to fix the drip rails correctly :/ Still needs the interior and a few misc pieces, but overall a really nice project.  I have cut the dash out, just need to repair the cowl top and weld the dash top back in, a couple rust spots in the fenders, not alot else wrong that I can find.  It really is in decent shape for its age.

So, HI!

[69Z28-RS]

Welcome to CRG!   Seems you have a pretty nice project on your hands.. 

[MooneyDriver]

Thanks! I did autobody for 4 years, so hopefully I wont have too many questions, but Im sure Ill have some.  Hoping to get as much done as possible before it gets too cold, heat in the shop is poor at best, so we will see how much I get done before its too cold to work on it!  That and my 3mo old son takes alot of my time.

[VINCE Z28]

Hi MooneyDriver what part of Washington State do you live ? and did you buy the car in Oregon?

[MooneyDriver]

Lynden, I got it about 20 miles from here in Bow, but maybe a past owner was?

[VINCE Z28]

Yes up by the B.C. boader, I'm at the other end of I-5 in S.W. WA. down by Portland, Oregon. The tax free State (Sales tax) I save alot of $ on car parts. Are you planning to put bumper guards on the 67? I have a original set, rechromed, all hardwear, new rubber.

[MooneyDriver]

Im not sure Im going to put a front bumper on, the rear has guards.   Any other parts?

My quarters are out for delivery, should see them in an hour or two!

[VINCE Z28]

Lower front valance, most of what I have is for 69 Chevelle .

[MooneyDriver]

already have that, thanks though!

Couple more pics

origional paint in the jams


even the stock jack


Bunch of parts (chin spoiler, core support, drip rails, both outer rear wheel tubs

[VINCE Z28]

124377L00824, The 824th camaro made that year?

[MooneyDriver]

124377L00824, The 824th camaro made that year?

Is that bad?

tag:

[cook_dw]

Nice project & welcome.  Bolero Red, black guts, 327ci, M35 coded trans (turbo 350) with console, Z21 trim package.  Original subframe too.  I.E. no access holes in the front horns.  Hard to tell from the photos but looks like a solid car.  Whats the plans on the resto?   I would put it back stock or a "day 2 setup" and make it a great little cruiser.  Regardless build it how you want & enjoy it..!!.

[Sauron327]

Ive order quarter skins,

In my opinion and as someone with a couple decades of experience, full quarters are easier and a superior repair compared to skins. I'd suggest AMD qrts unless you prefer early stamped NOS tin. Here is a thread on AMD quarters with comparisons to GM and other repro tin. http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=212160&highlight=67+amd+quarter+panels

[MooneyDriver]

its origionally coded a turbo 350 with a console?  It has the column shifter and only a L and D, so I assumed powerglide, but it def has a TH350 in it.

Plans are to make it a driver, not a trailer queen, my brother has a '57 chevy, so we can do some car shows and go cruising.  Its a super solid car, zero rust in the doors, rockers, floor and trunk pans. Just the usual in the fenders, dash, rear lower window channel edges, wheel lip.

Got my quarter skins today! pretty excited! I didnt go with the full quarters because of cost, and didnt want to have to mess with resetting gaps and all that trouble I read about all the time. In my mind I guess this seemed to be the easiest way. Although in hindsight, I kinda need the very tops of the quarters at the sail panel area, the drip rail rust got them a little bit.   But every part I bought has been AMD so far.

Also, the dash rust was pretty good, whats the top cowl piece called? Ill upload pics tomorrow.

Thanks!

[MooneyDriver]

Wife and I were initially thinking of grey with black stripes, but being it was origional red, we found this one, and are thinking this looks pretty nice!



backend needs a little love, car did come with a new back piece NIB yet. Also have a rear spoiler



Here is some of the dash rust I cut the dosh top off saturday, car came with a new one of those too, but think I may need the top cowl piece? Or should I weld strips to rebuild what was there?

[69Z28-RS]

124377L00824, The 824th camaro made that year?

Since 1967 was maiden year for Camaro, 824th Camaro EVER off the line (in Los Angeles)..      Not sure how many Norwood cars would have been made before that???

[KurtS]

It had a powerglide originally. The TH350 didn't come out til 1969.

[cook_dw]

Your right idk what I was thinking..  Sorry

Also I was wrong about the console too since it was a LOS car.  Damn I was sucking it yesterday..  Does it even have the bracket or holes for one in the tunnel?  I see it has an auto column.

[MooneyDriver]

No holes in the tunnel, thats why you had me wondering, haha

[MooneyDriver]

Big truck for little parts




Yes, skins, I know.... Everyone says full quarters, in hind sight, I could use the top of the quarters to help repair the drip rail areas, but there is so little rust in the quarter it just seemed like the way to go... But, If anyone has those sail pieces leftover.........  

[Sauron327]

I've seen the photos at T. Camaro of your driprails. Since you need a roof skin too I'd suggest asking the shipper for a return label and have them send full AMD quarters. Use panel adhesive for the entire roof skin perimeter except the A-pillars and sails, they are to be welded solid.

[MooneyDriver]

you think they will take them back and exchange? hate to loose the 100 bucks I spent on shipping

[Sauron327]

Call them, maybe they'll cover it or meet you half way. From what vendor were they purchased? Better to lose a hundred bucks and do the job the right, easier and faster way.

[MooneyDriver]

Jegs, chatting with them now.

Thanks

[MooneyDriver]

ok, they said I have to pay the return shipping ($100) to return them. So I just made an ad on craigslist for what I have into them to see if I can sell them without taking the 100 dollar hit. I still really really dont want to have to deal with the nightmare of setting up all the gaps, wish I could find a sail panel.

I have some of my ford race parts on ebay, auction ends tonight, if it sells Ill have enough to buy the remaining sheetmetal parts asap (roof, full rear quarters)

[MyRed67]

its origionally coded a turbo 350 with a console?  It has the column shifter and only a L and D, so I assumed powerglide, but it def has a TH350 in it.
Thanks!

Welcome MooneyD!  Nice project you got there.  It would have came with a Powerglide, TH 350's didn't come along until very late '68, a few Camaros were used as "Mules".  There should be a 2M on the lower left of your Cowl Tag.   BTW, your car seems very similar to mine.

[MooneyDriver]

Thanks! Yep, cowl tag has the 2M

Do you have a build thread on yours? Im addicted to reading others restos

[Sauron327]

It's not a nightmare. You would have more time in buttwelding and skimming that skin seam than throwing on a full qrt. Out of box AMD qrts are not that bad. Chances are the deklid radii and lid to qrt sides will be off. If you want gaps better than factory then mods are required. Rebuild your door hinges and align them to the old quarters. If you don't want to do the hinges, send them to Willie. 8 and 9 hinges are a no-brainer but I send my 67 hiunges to Willie because he does and excellent job for the money, bettter than any rebuild kit you can buy.

http://www.hoodhingerepair.com/

I still really really dont want to have to deal with the nightmare of setting up all the gaps, wish I could find a sail panel.

[MooneyDriver]

few pics of the factory quarter job, the right side I can see daylight through it 

[MyRed67]

MooneyD,  here's links to my Picturetrail;

1.  http://www.picturetrail.net/sfx/album/view/24467198

2.  http://www.picturetrail.net/sfx/album/view/24467727

3.  http://www.picturetrail.net/sfx/album/view/24467734

4.  http://www.picturetrail.net/sfx/album/view/24475463

5.  http://www.picturetrail.net/sfx/album/view/24475491

6.  http://www.picturetrail.net/sfx/album/view/24475500

[MooneyDriver]

awesome!!

[MooneyDriver]

A couple questions in my mind, but the first one, the front fenders, where they always rust out between the support and the skin, on the lower section, is there a way to permanently seal that so it doesnt happen again? Or just coat it with undercoating and hope for the best?  Seems a bad design, the way stuff can get in there and not get out (obviously as they commonly rust there)

 

[MooneyDriver]

It makes noise, on its own, wanted to see if it will run before ripping it out, sounds pretty good!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijSMAroLoMQ

[MyRed67]

It makes noise, on its own, wanted to see if it will run before ripping it out, sounds pretty good!

What is that squelling noise?  I wouldn't run it too long or too often without a radiator.  BTW; mine has the original 327 in it also.  Dressed up to look like a 302.  Lot of real 302 trim pieces.

[MooneyDriver]

the fan belt, running it a little bit without water wont hurt, dont worry, Im not going to take it on a cruise, haha..

 Just wanted to run it and do a compression check before ripping it out and apart. probably see what it has for pistons, change the cam, and turn the power up a little bit. nothing worse than a muscle car that cant spin the rear tires!

[1968RSZ28]

Sounds like a 1930 Model 92 Maytag washing machine engine!     

Paul

[MooneyDriver]

Sounds like a 1930 Model 92 Maytag washing machine engine!      

Paul

HAHA, you must have been surfing my vids.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njrBZZ90g00

Car sounds like it may have a little cam to it, I have no clue whats all been done to the engine, either did the guy I got it from.

[67rs327]

MooneyDriver - glad to see another LOS '67 coming back to life.  Mines an 11A.  Bolero Red w/Black interior (L30 motor w/M20 4 speed). Lots to do like yours. I'm sure we'll be comparing notes.
Q: I was looking at your vin tag and noticed what looks like 3 numbers stamped above the production number (106 or 186?) I don't recall seeing that before. Anyone?

[MyRed67]

A couple questions in my mind, but the first one, the front fenders, where they always rust out between the support and the skin, on the lower section, is there a way to permanently seal that so it doesnt happen again? Or just coat it with undercoating and hope for the best?  Seems a bad design, the way stuff can get in there and not get out (obviously as they commonly rust there)

  I know what you're saying, but most of our cars at this point in their lives lead pretty pamper lives, so you'll most likely never see the rust issue again in your lifetime.  You could always spray a little truck bed liner in there, would probably be better than under-coating.  Or, I have a spray bomb can of plastic coating, not sure where I got it, or for what.

[MyRed67]

Just wanted to run it and do a compression check before ripping it out and apart. probably see what it has for pistons, change the cam, and turn the power up a little bit. nothing worse than a muscle car that cant spin the rear tires!

  Mine was 210 hp. 2 bbl., it's now pushing 400 hp.  Has "Double-hump" 2.02 Heads,  Comp. cam (480 lift), a REAL Z ...610 intake, 10.3 comp.  Has a "built" TH 350 with a 2500 stall Converter, and 4:11  12 bolt Posi.   Git-R-Done.  The Heads and Forged Crank are '64 Vette pieces. Put in all ARP bolts, I think it will hold together.  I've "thrashed" some other 327's before in my lifetime that weren't put together near as well as this one.

[MyRed67]

Q: I was looking at your vin tag and noticed what looks like 3 numbers stamped above the production number (106 or 186?) I don't recall seeing that before. Anyone?

67rs327,  that's an inter-plant production run #, was only used in LOS.

[KurtS]

Wife and I were initially thinking of grey with black stripes, but being it was origional red, we found this one, and are thinking this looks pretty nice!

Personally, I like the red, but I tire of seeing non-Z cars with Z-stripes.
How about this, which is what it originally looked like?

[67rs327]

Mike,
Interesting on the number. I know you have an 11a also. Does it have these other numbers? Mine does not.
Thanks-Chris

[MooneyDriver]

Personally, I like the red, but I tire of seeing non-Z cars with Z-stripes.
How about this, which is what it originally looked like?

I hear you, seems everyone makes SS and RS's, I just like racing stripes and never had a car with them yet. And we chose the darker red, because were just not bright red fans.  If the car was something special other than a base car, Id probably be more of a stickler to going totally stock.

[MooneyDriver]

did a compression check, all holes are about 155psi, Ill try to remember to get the numbers off the engine and see what it came out of, supposedly Im getting the stock block too, one of these days.

See how much time I have last weekend, last night I spent a few hours trying to get the rest of the dash off the cowl top piece, they sure put alot of spot welds on there!  Hope to get half a day to work on it tomorrow as well.

[MyRed67]

Mike,
Interesting on the number. I know you have an 11a also. Does it have these other numbers? Mine does not.
Thanks-Chris

Chris,  Yes, mine has those #'s.  I'm assuming you're talking about the A638.

[MyRed67]

Personally, I like the red, but I tire of seeing non-Z cars with Z-stripes.
How about this, which is what it originally looked like?

[/quote]
I like that look also.  I considered many options, even some different colors.  One option I considered was original Bolero Red with "Stinger" Hood with "Stinger" stripe.  I still 2 nd. guess that option some times.

[Sauron327]

the first one, the front fenders, where they always rust out between the support and the skin, on the lower section, is there a way to permanently seal that so it doesnt happen again? Or just coat it with undercoating and hope for the best?  Seems a bad design, the way stuff can get in there and not get out (obviously as they commonly rust there)

 

When you repair them just spilt the brace from the fender, blast and epoxy. Undercoating does more harm than good. Don't seal it, if you do, whatever water gets in will be trapped. Vehicles are not designed to last. I've repaired numerous newer vehicles this year due to rot.

[67rs327]

Mike - not on the cowl tag. I have those also. If you blow up the picture of the VIN on the door jamb - there looks to be 3
stamped numbers above the actual production number??

[MooneyDriver]

When you repair them just spilt the brace from the fender, blast and epoxy. Undercoating does more harm than good. Don't seal it, if you do, whatever water gets in will be trapped. Vehicles are not designed to last. I've repaired numerous newer vehicles this year due to rot.

Good call, Ill look into that! Thanks!

[69glacierblue]

Love the dark red you are thinking of.  Agree on the epoxy.  Best of luck on the resto...keep the pics coming as you make progress!

[MyRed67]

Mike - not on the cowl tag. I have those also. If you blow up the picture of the VIN on the door jamb - there looks to be 3
stamped numbers above the actual production number??

Chris,  No, mine just has the Vin.# and CHEVROLET  00 along what would be the top edge.

[MooneyDriver]

Here is the full size of that door jam tag

http://johnvh.smugmug.com/Other/67-Camaro-Project/44202810_Qz3rCv#!i=3523708160&k=PHqvSdQ&lb=1&s=O

has a 106 stamped to the right of the vin

[Mike S]

 As I understand it, those extra stamps on the VIN tag was done by the dealer when they received it. I don't remember where I read that though. I have seen those extra stamps a couple of times on NOR cars too.

Mike

[Mike S]

 Looking at this picture posted in reply #14 I see what looks like black paint over spray as indicated by the red arrow where the wiper motor is. I had asked this question before on CRG if there should be firewall blackout over spray in that area and the reply was no and the reasoning is the hole was covered. I found it odd in a way that a line worker would take time to cover a hole and yet the top edge blackout varies widely from car to car even though its stated there was a type of a cover overlaid on the cowl top.
This picture sure looks like black over spray to me.

Mike

[MooneyDriver]

Ill get better pics of that for you today

[MooneyDriver]

yesterdays pics

Engine block numbers


Pics behind the wiper





Firewall


XOXO


Cut part of one quarter out, the worst side, to see what was in there, pretty good shape






Free wax!


I dont know if the offset it wrong, or the tires too big? But both sides will turn and rub the frame


Origional paint in jams and firewall shines right up!

[MooneyDriver]

also, what measurements do you all take before removing a roof? I dont have a front windshield to check fits, I guess any tips for replacing that, and the rear tail panel, Ill probably end up buying the upper cowl piece too, instead of trying to fabricate all the rusted stuff from flat sheetmetal.

Thanks

[Sauron327]

No measurements needed. However, the roof skin may need some mods in the corners. I have a ceiling fixture that allows me to install roof skins by myself. Pretty easy to rig one up. All the moldings will keed to be fit. Tailpanel is pretty straightforward. You'll see what needs to be done when it's mocked up with the new quarters. You'll need an attachment for your stud gum for the molding pins. A box of 500 mold rivets is about 15 bucks.

also, what measurements do you all take before removing a roof? I dont have a front windshield to check fits, I guess any tips for replacing that, and the rear tail panel, Ill probably end up buying the upper cowl piece too, instead of trying to fabricate all the rusted stuff from flat sheetmetal.

Thanks

[MooneyDriver]

Oh yes, I was going to ask about those molding pins, thanks!!

Sold my race car parts so I can order the rest of the sheetmetal soon, hoping someone local will buy my skins so I dont have to eat another $100 in shipping to return them.

[Sauron327]

Hope you bought AMD quarters.

[MooneyDriver]

Everything is AMD only.

Except for the tail piece, and the dash, and the front header, only because it came with them.

[Mike S]

Ill get better pics of that for you today

I see what looked like blackout paint is actually dirt. Looks like the wiper motor hole covered explanation looks to be valid so far.
What is that silver tag on the motor head?

Mike

[MooneyDriver]

What is that silver tag on the motor head?

Mike

Im guessing its from whoever rebuilt the engine, I was told its not the origional, but seems the numbers date it in the ballpark, what would the origional block have for numbers?

Anyone know what the pin welding tool is actually called? Having trouble finding it.

[Sauron327]

Everything is AMD only.

Except for the tail piece, and the dash, and the front header, only because it came with them.

If you look at that AMD link I posted, note the differences between other tailpanels and the AMD panel when compared to GM.

[MooneyDriver]

Everything is AMD only.

Except for the tail piece, and the dash, and the front header, only because it came with them.

If you look at that AMD link I posted, note the differences between other tailpanels and the AMD panel when compared to GM.

Thanks, yep, seen the thread.

[MooneyDriver]

question, looking at the dash/cowl panels that I need, the top pieces that are rusted on my car, whats it called exactly? I see parts listed for an upper, and lower cowl panels, they show some same pictures, its confusing... is this the part I need?

http://www.autometaldirect.com/x-parts-67-camaro-firebird-lower-cowl-panel-p-3770.html

http://www.jegs.com/i/Auto-Metal-Direct/106/X360-3567/10002/-1

I need this so I can cut the back two parts off to weld into my dash/firewall area... Seems alot easier than patching and trying to match the curve of it all..



Once I figure this out, I have my finger on the trigger for the roof, both full quarters, and above part

[z28z11]

Anyone know what the pin welding tool is actually called? Having trouble finding it.
[/quote]

Look in Eastwood's catalog. You can get a cheaper stud welder through Northern or Harbor Freight, but Eastwood has the pins and the collet. The moulding studs need to welded, don't use screws.

Regards -

[MooneyDriver]

I have a high quality stud gun from my autobody days, but never done these little things, Thanks!

Here is the numbers on the front of my block, what is this thing?

FI003S

[MooneyDriver]

got quiet out there!

Trying to figure out how to ship the quarter skins back, looks like that was a few hundred dollar mistake ordering them, cant find a cost effective way to return them to Jegs, and since it has to go freight, they leave it up to me to figure out how to get them there... trucking quotes are over 4-500, on $160 worth of parts...  Being on a budget, Im kind of depressed about that,  Guess Ill have to suck it up and hang onto them until I can figure out how to sell them locally, anyone needs a pair to hang in a man cave or something?

Also still overthinking the cowl top piece, thought about buying a cheap dash top and cutting it up as it should have the right curve to it, have to think on that one, $200 vs $60 and a bunch of fab work....  Probably just buy that upper/lower cowl piece, once I figure out if its the right part.  sigh

[MooneyDriver]

ok, Ive put it off long enough, just hit submit on the order for AMD full quarters, roof, cowl piece I had above, panel in front of trunk between quarters..... Hopefully final sheetmetal order for me.

[MyRed67]

Sorry Mooney, I haven't been following this lately.  I ran into a BIG surprise on the top of my Cowl right under the lower edge of Windshield when restoring my car.  It still had the original Windshield (cracked)in the car, so assumed it had never been taken out  Mostly because I had heard (somewhere) that 9 times out of 10 these old Windshields will crack when you remove them.  Anyhow, someone had removed the Windshield and done body work (filler) under the lower edge of the Windshield.  They did a good job, as it wasn't noticeable, until you ground into it.  BUT, they filled over rust.  I'm gonna post a couple pics..  I did not replace the Whole Cowl, because I was told that if you replace the whole Cowl, and move the Trim Tag over to the new one, you need Police/ or State Department official present to witness and document it.  Plus the fact you are going to loose your partial Vin #s.  There are 3 layers of metal all come together right in that area.  I replaced the top Dash, and the bottom layer of the 3 was still pretty solid.  We cleaned that up as best we could and treated it with Rust Converter.  Then we pieced in what was missing of the back edge of the top of the cowl.  I hope these pics. give you some idea what we did.

[MyRed67]

Here's pics. of the body work finished, ( should be able to tell there is very little filler"Dyna-glass") and a pic. of it all primed.

[MooneyDriver]

yes, going to kinda do like you did, maybe a little different, planning to cut the top of the cowl piece off behind the wiper arms and replace it with new from the part I ordered.  Initially I was going to fab it up, but just too many curves there to mess with.

Thanks!

[MyRed67]

yes, going to kinda do like you did, maybe a little different, planning to cut the top of the cowl piece off behind the wiper arms and replace it with new from the part I ordered.  Initially I was going to fab it up, but just too many curves there to mess with.

Thanks!

Actually if you look closely you will see that those ridges around the wipers end about 3 in. from the back edge of the top of the Cowl panel.  Yes the back edge is curved but it is flat.  We did that whole back edge in about 4 sections.  We used poster board to make templates to get the curve right.

[Sauron327]

because I was told that if you replace the whole Cowl, and move the Trim Tag over to the new one, you need Police/ or State Department official present to witness and document it. 

That only applies to VINs, not TTs. At least in this state because the TT has nothing to do with motor vehicle registration, the VIN does.

[MyRed67]

because I was told that if you replace the whole Cowl, and move the Trim Tag over to the new one, you need Police/ or State Department official present to witness and document it. 

That only applies to VINs, not TTs. At least in this state because the TT has nothing to do with motor vehicle registration, the VIN does.

But would still loose your partial Vin. #'s.  To me those are important part of the history of the car.

[MooneyDriver]

Im not planning to replace either parts that have a tag.

[Sauron327]

because I was told that if you replace the whole Cowl, and move the Trim Tag over to the new one, you need Police/ or State Department official present to witness and document it. 

That only applies to VINs, not TTs. At least in this state because the TT has nothing to do with motor vehicle registration, the VIN does.

But would still loose your partial Vin. #'s.  To me those are important part of the history of the car.

Understood. But there are times when a part is so rotten that complete replacement is required. Document the repair and save the partial if it's not rotten off.

[MooneyDriver]

two full quarters, and a roof just arrived! Still not excited to do these, but excited I have ALL the parts I hopefully need for the car, the cowl piece should be here soon, it shipped today.

Now to read as much as I can about installing these pieces, and finding threads with alot of pictures.

[MooneyDriver]

Started drilling spotwelds for the roof to come off, got the top of the rear window drilled out and loose, next time in there I should be able to get the front drilled out.

[Sauron327]

Roof skin removal procedure: Grind the paint off the A pillar and sail panel then melt the lead out. Bulk drop the whole center of the roof skin. Drill the spotwelds front and rear. Grind the drip rail spotwelds using a 3/16" grinding wheel on your cutoff tool and peel out the remnant. If you need new drip rails disregard this step. Some cut off discs stacked will do but you'll need a 3/16" or 1/4" wheel for dressing welds anyway. Note the location of any molding studs. You'll find they are located near arrows in the channel, repro skins don't have arrows.

[MooneyDriver]

since Im taking the quarters off, do I need to mess with the lead in the sail panels? Cant just cut it all off?

BTW, whats the best spot weld cutter these days? Im using the brooch style, as thats all Ive ever used, but curious.

[Sauron327]

 The quarter sails are welded to the inner structure so the lead has to go. Your Rotobroach bit is fine, the cheap double ended Balir ones are junk. I primarily use the drill bit style as shown in the link. I don't buy them there, I get them at my jobber. http://www.autobodytoolmart.com/spot-weld-cutters-c-606.aspx?pagenum=2

[MooneyDriver]

sounds good, thanks.

[MooneyDriver]

Pulled the 327 so its out of the way, got the windshield spot welds drilled out, and the lead melted out of the seams..



only other numbers I found on it








If I can get some time today Im hoping to get the roof off.

[MooneyDriver]

Roofs off, I cut the tops of the quarters off and around the drip rails to get all that out of the way and cleaned up, made measurements, and notes on what I needed, put new pins and bushings in the doors and got them lining up to the quarters perfectly, got the trunk lined up and gapped right, wire brushed the surface rust off the roof structures, pretty much ready to cut the passenger quarter off.







Someone got happy with the drill here for some reason

[MooneyDriver]

one thing Im not looking forward to, is drilling out the spots in the trunk gasket lip, why cant they simply make that part of the quarters and other pieces?

I see AMD makes the pieces, whats the big top one? Looks odd...

http://www.jegs.com/i/Auto-Metal-Direct/106/825-3567-S/10002/-1

[MyRed67]

MooneyDriver;  if you're replacing the 1/4's you need to read this link.  I was fortunate and was right at that stage of restoration when this post came up.

http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=8653.0

[MooneyDriver]

cool, Ill have to see if mine has them or not from the factory.

[MyRed67]

cool, Ill have to see if mine has them or not from the factory.

They would have been there from the factory.  If they are not there somebody removed them.  I would be willing to bet they're still there, I just wanted you to see this link so you know how to re-install them.

[MooneyDriver]

Perfect, thanks

[KurtS]

John,
Do you have the original decklid for the car?
What are some of the dates from the seat belts?
I'd be curious on the axle and trans codes whenever you get them - no hurry.

Thanks!

[MooneyDriver]

John,
Do you have the original decklid for the car?
What are some of the dates from the seat belts?
I'd be curious on the axle and trans codes whenever you get them - no hurry.

Thanks!

I do, but the car was backed into something, and the decklid is a little goobered up, as well as the back of the car.  The aftermarket lid actually fit just as good, plus has the spots for the rear spoiler to get drilled.



Here is the origional decklid on the back of the trailer

[KurtS]

I'd seen that pic of the belt, but I can't read the week code.  xx A 66. What's on the others?
Can I get a pic of the underside of the original decklid?

Thanks!

[MooneyDriver]

Ill snap those after work, I should have read my notifications, I was just there, haha.

[MooneyDriver]

[cook_dw]

Can you make out the stamp code on the trunk lid?

[KurtS]

Belts - that's the date I've seen on another early LOS car. Very early date.
Decklid - they used that most of the way thru 67 production. There was an earlier version, but I'm not sure LOS ever got that version.
I'm also curious on the decklid date. Should have asked that. No hurry.

Thanks!

[MooneyDriver]

Where should I look?

[cook_dw]

Below the vertical slot that is below the jacking instructions.  Itll probably be hard to read.

[MooneyDriver]

[MyRed67]

That is an early date code.  I'm thinking last week of August??

[69Z28-RS]

I thought Week 34 would be  22-26 Aug 1966 ,

 but per this calendar:  http://www.calendar-12.com/calendar/1966

It would be the week before that (25-29 August) with week 1 beginning with a week having only 1 day (1 Jan) in the new 1966 year.
I suppose it would depend on how that stamper did their 'weeks'....

[Mike S]

Decklid - they used that most of the way thru 67 production. There was an earlier version, but I'm not sure LOS ever got that version.
I'm also curious on the decklid date. Should have asked that. No hurry.

Thanks!

  The lid with the center elongated hole was for the '66 period, correct?

Mike

[cook_dw]

At this point the only data I have collected show early LOS cars.  Still need more early NOR cars to add to my list to make a determination.  At least on the data I have been collecting.

[MooneyDriver]

if it helps any, here is the stampings on the rear quarters




What are you trying to determine?

[KurtS]

Decklid - they used that most of the way thru 67 production. There was an earlier version, but I'm not sure LOS ever got that version.
I'm also curious on the decklid date. Should have asked that. No hurry.

Thanks!

  The lid with the center elongated hole was for the '66 period, correct?

Mike

I'll correct my statement (I misread some data):
Yes, on 66 built cars, both NOR and LOS.  Changed on NOR cars about the beginning of the calendar year. Probably LOS too.

[MooneyDriver]

ok, been a few months since Ive had time to get any solid time on it, between the cold WX (no heat in the shop), and having to put a new motor in the inlaws exploder, I finally got to spend 5 hrs on it today, here what the damage I did.

Pass quarter is off, rear panel is off, piece between the trunk and window is off, fuel tank is out.

[MooneyDriver]

so whats the trick to getting the piece of quarter out of here? Or should I have left a lip and butted it up? Might do that on the drivers side....  Thoughts?







ALOT of spot welds on this, I just went at it with a grinder on each weld, I counted like 86 just in that center section!




Had to put the new back piece on for fun! Its not a big deal, but gives ya the feeling of the new to come!


Under part doesnt touch it, I knew it was pushed in some, Ill bang on that once the quarter is sitting in place.

[firstgenaddict]

Is that part of the build sheet on the right corner of the fuel tank?

[MooneyDriver]

Is that part of the build sheet on the right corner of the fuel tank?

I tried to read it but the lettering was gone, probably whatever they had at the factory for labeling parts?

[rick 67]

 That is the factory build sheet do not disturb it. I am sure you will get lots of advice on how to safely remove  it. IT IS GOLD be careful !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MyRed67]

Mooney,  pic. #5 in that last group of pics., you need to read this; (Mystery part)
http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=8653.0
that part is quite often left out when quarter panels are repaced.

[MooneyDriver]

That is the factory build sheet do not disturb it. I am sure you will get lots of advice on how to safely remove  it. IT IS GOLD be careful !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh? I thought the build sheets were on the interiors of the cars.

Mooney,  pic. #5 in that last group of pics., you need to read this; (Mystery part)
http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=8653.0
that part is quite often left out when quarter panels are repaced.

Yep, I know what it is, and to put it back on, it wasnt doing much, it has a HUGE gap to the quarter, and is welded to the 'gutter'

side view, and I didnt chip anything out, its just hanging in the breeze

[rick 67]

 Ah the La built cars had one slapped on top of the gas tank.  Careful with it until some experts chime in about it.

Rick

[MooneyDriver]

Oh cool. Thanks Rick!

[KurtS]

It could be a piece of tape. Gotta clean it and see.

[MyRed67]

Mooney,  pic. #5 in that last group of pics., you need to read this; (Mystery part)
http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=8653.0
that part is quite often left out when quarter panels are repaced.

Yep, I know what it is, and to put it back on, it wasnt doing much, it has a HUGE gap to the quarter, and is welded to the 'gutter'

side view, and I didnt chip anything out, its just hanging in the breeze

[/quote]
 
That article that posted link to states what you need to use to fill in the gap.

[MyRed67]

Mooney,  pic. #5 in that last group of pics., you need to read this; (Mystery part)
http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=8653.0
that part is quite often left out when quarter panels are repaced.

Yep, I know what it is, and to put it back on, it wasn't doing much, it has a HUGE gap to the quarter, and is welded to the 'gutter'

side view, and I didnt chip anything out, its just hanging in the breeze

That article that I posted link to states what you need to use to fill in the gap.
[/quote]

[MooneyDriver]

Ok, a little more progress, got the rest of the old quarter off, and out of the trunk drip rails



New quarter test fit for fun time


Its just in place with a few vice grips to see how it looks, itll need a little tweaking, but not too bad.






and Ive kinda fallen back to the origional color, I know I said I wasnt a big bright red color fan, but it looks ok, plus its original..  not sure on the rs grille yet, but definitely thing the white nose stripe, with the rocker chrome, wheel well chrome, might leave off the front bumper, not sure yet.

[Sauron327]

I just installed another tulip (deck filler) panel which was a CHL part with molding pins included. Perfect fit unlike others I've done. You can glue the tulip to the gutter. It's not only faster and stronger but seals also.

[MooneyDriver]

tinkering on it, trying to get the front of the quarter down to match the top of the door and the bodylines, seems the 'foot' of the front of the quarter in the door jamb maybe goes too low? It wont go down any more, but I need it to move 1/8"+ lower.




Then the dreaded back panel, I think its an OER, it came with the car, but the top curve is quite a ways off.. wondering if I should order an AMD one to replace it.

[MyRed67]

Mooney, sorry I didn't catch this sooner.  In 67 in the Door jam area on the front of the Quarter  panel there was 3 different stamping designs.  I believe your car would have had the first design, my 11A car had the middle design. I think all of the repop Quarter panels use the last design, at least that is what I have seen.  I am attaching a pic. to show how I saved that original portion of the Quarter panel.

[MooneyDriver]

ugh, might be too late to save it now, Ill have to have a look at the part I cut off.. I was definately considering doing the other quarter differently, but might have to do the whole thing so they match..  

[MooneyDriver]

Yep, dont know how I missed that, Im bummed now...
 I might try to repair the original jamb area and graft it back in so its correct....  The other side I wont be doing the same way for sure now.

 

[MyRed67]

As I thought Mooney, your original jam stamping is the first design.  Did not have the vertical "hash" marks.  At least you caught it before you had to redo both sides.

[MooneyDriver]

As I thought Mooney, your original jam stamping is the first design.  Did not have the vertical "hash" marks.  At least you caught it before you had to redo both sides.

Thanks for bringing it up, wish I paid more attention, my mindset was in the 'replace the whole quarter' after all the advice, doh!  Ill get it squared up though, with another days work, haha.

[Sauron327]

If you are going through that hassle you may as well graft in the run numbers in the decklid area. You'll need to fit the quarter window U-seal and mod that area accordingly, also the window felt ledge and mounting clip slots. The other possible differences between AMD and a GM quarter are in that AMD thread. Sometimes they weld the bumper reinforcement on backwards too.

[MooneyDriver]

If you are going through that hassle you may as well graft in the run numbers in the decklid area. You'll need to fit the quarter window U-seal and mod that area accordingly, also the window felt ledge and mounting clip slots. The other possible differences between AMD and a GM quarter are in that AMD thread. Sometimes they weld the bumper reinforcement on backwards too.

Not that worried about numbers, it would be nice if the door jambs looked period correct though..

Wish amd could make a part that fits properly without having to make so many mods as you describe..

[Sauron327]

The cost to make and maintain the dies to consistently duplicate assembly line sheet metal would be very high. And then every part would be expected to be nearly perfect .Most shops know what to expect of repro panels.  Not to mention many of these panels are being installed on previously done cars with repro parts so they would not line up anyway. Go buy a late stamped NOS fender and you will have a day labor minimum to fix the results of worn out dies.

[MooneyDriver]

Still getting the quarter to fit low enough at the door, the lower part that meets the rocker appears to be too long so Ive slowly been working the curve higher up the quarter so it sits lower, its really close now so the body line and the top of the door match the new quarter.   

[MyRed67]

[/quote]
Not that worried about numbers, it would be nice if the door jambs looked period correct though..
[/quote]

 That was exactly my thought.

[MooneyDriver]

Ok, worked on it a little saturday to play with the gaps yet, it appears the quarter is too thick at the door jam, when the door is flush with the rocker, the quarter sticks out about an 1/8", and it cant go in any more, the quarter window gap is too large as well..  Looks like I may have to split the quarter in the jam and take some out, dont think Ive seen anyone have to do that yet..

quarter window gaps, paint pen measurement was what factory had




factory gap on drivers side



Maybe grafting this back in, since I need the origional jam anyway

[BULLITT65]

Hey keep up the good work. Your doing great making this much progress with a toddler around the house. WTG.
Keep the pics coming, I really like seeing your updates...

BTW guys would kill to have an original red car, so going red is a safe play since it is the factory color.

In the end you are making the car for yourself though, so if you intend on keeping it, build the car you are going to enjoy.

( I like the red with white/black band around the front) But I am a big fan of red obviously....

[MooneyDriver]

Haha, thanks, Im trying, the wife is pretty good about giving me time to tinker on the car, but the kid does his best to make sure I dont get enough sleep or have much energy.

When the weather warms up Ill get mroe done to it, its not much fun when your car is 40 degrees

[MooneyDriver]

Something I was noticing, before removing the quarter I made the door fit 100% perfect to it (pins and bushings were a little worn so both doors were sagging), the passenger side fit the quarter perfect, and fit the rocker perfect gap wise..

I was checking the driver side for fun, which also fits the quarter perfect, but the rocker gap is not perfect, the quarters have not been replaced, so the factory put one on a little off? Im guessing I need to make it fit the rocker, then make the quarter fit the door, on the driver side when I get to it, right?

Thanks

[Sauron327]

The factory did not make gaps on these cars perfect. I have a 67 that the original quarter was installed so poorly at the factory to the tailpanel it was a joke. I had to cut it apart and do it over because I did not want it to reflect on my work. Not only did it fit badly, the rear of the quarter was defective and was split at the die draw marks. It also had jog in the top near the forward radius of the decklid gutter. The quarter supports that are supposed to be welded to the inner sailpanel/weatherstrip channel never got welded. Survivor cars are not always the prettiest.

[MooneyDriver]

Ok, I figured, thank you! I have noticed a few things that I find odd/funny on fit, missed welds, etc. All part of the 'fun'

[MooneyDriver]

ok, found out why my window gap is off, AMD panel is made wrong here too, thinner than factory

Origional GM panel



AMD panel

[Sauron327]

I addressed that narrow ledge in this thread: http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=212160&highlight=67+amd+quarter+panel&page=2 That is not all you will find that needs modifications.

[MyRed67]

I addressed that narrow ledge in this thread: http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=212160&highlight=67+amd+quarter+panel&page=2 That is not all you will find that needs modifications.

   I've been hearing that AMD panels are the best on the market, is that not true?

[MooneyDriver]

   I've been hearing that AMD panels are the best on the market, is that not true?

I assumed so when I did my research, thats why I bought all AMD parts for my car. That said, if they are the best, Id hate to see the worst! haha.

[MooneyDriver]

I addressed that narrow ledge in this thread: http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=212160&highlight=67+amd+quarter+panel&page=2 That is not all you will find that needs modifications.

Thanks, printing your whole AMD fixing thread off.  Mine seems to be evenly off front to back for the most part.

[Sauron327]

They usually are the best on the market among what is available, and still there are variations in quality. It is common knowledge in the restoration business that reproduction panels require modifications to fit, and stamping inconsistencies are to be expected. Heartbeat City has USA made fenders for $800 each.  For that price I would want a guarantee they are as good as the best assembly line take off.

I've had to throw a day of labor at late stamped NOS fenders because the stampings were so bad.

  I've been hearing that AMD panels are the best on the market, is that not true?

[MooneyDriver]

My new AMD tail panel just arrived, yay!  Hopefully the last body part I need to buy

[MooneyDriver]

So just fiddling with getting the quarter fitting right, seems like it should be tighter fitting here? Rear side window opening





Also getting the drip rail to fit, its definately not as good as factory, the notches are not in the same place, if that matters