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Author Topic: Original Air Cleaner for 69 SS  (Read 16350 times)
69OlympicGoldSS
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« on: October 15, 2006, 07:35:24 AM »

Does anyone have a picture of what the original air cleaner looked like on a '69 Camaro with the SS 350 cu. in 300 H.P. engine?  Just curious if this set-up is correct, which I kind of doubt.

Thanks in advance.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2006, 07:38:00 AM by 69OlympicGoldSS » Logged

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gro51
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« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2006, 07:23:55 PM »

No that's not original.  I don't hav a pic but it would be an enclosed air cleaner with a snorkel pointing to the passenger side.   Base is black.  Chrome lid.
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Joe
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« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2006, 08:08:40 PM »

69 300 hp air cleaner is an enclosed unit with a snorkle pointed towards the right side. on automatics a heat stove tube went from the bottom of the snorkle to the exhaust manifold.  cover was black,although standard in 67 and 8  chrome engine trim became an option in 69.  I dont know how to post a pic here but if you want to contack me i will send you a great shot of mine.  rsss35069@aol.com
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JohnZ
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« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2006, 09:52:57 AM »

There was no option for a chrome engine dress-up package in '69.
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« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2006, 09:30:14 PM »

there certainly was,  thanks
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KurtS
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« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2006, 11:41:37 AM »

there certainly was, thanks
OK, if you think there was a chrome engine dress-up option, what is the Regular Production Option (RPO) #??

That option never existed for 69 Camaros so you'll have some problems finding it.....
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Kurt S
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« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2006, 01:48:50 PM »

I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, but I will throw some fuel on the fire:

A 1969 Camaro order sheet shows "bright engine accents" as included equipment on the SS (RPO Z27).   Also, the "Camaro 1967-1969 Fact Book" by F. J. R. Incremona (copyright 1984), shows a few pictures of a supposed original '69 SS 350 and it looks to me to have a chrome air cleaner lid as well as the polished finned aluminum valve covers.   According to Mr. Incremona, "Much time and effort has been spent in locating and photographing original cars."


           
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Joe
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« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2006, 02:00:27 PM »

I'll also throw some fuel on the fire.  I met the author of that book many years ago.  I wouldn't put all my eggs in that basket, just because he said that....... Roll Eyes
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« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2006, 02:15:15 PM »

I hear 'ya Steve.  But what about the order sheet?  Th '69 SS has the same wording as the '68 with regard to the bright engine accents, and we know for sure the '68 had the chrome lid.   It seems strange to me that it would be dropped in '69 but yet they kept the bright valve covers? Huh 
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Joe
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« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2006, 12:57:11 AM »

I was responding specifically to the 'chrome engine dress-up package' option, which never existed.

69 SS350 would have a chrome air cleaner (same one as a LM1 and there's a pic of one in the LM1 article) and painted steel valve covers.
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« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2006, 10:24:54 AM »

<<shows a few pictures of a supposed original '69 SS 350 and it looks to me to have a chrome air cleaner lid as well as the polished finned aluminum valve covers.  >>

No '69 ever had polished finned aluminum valve covers - that's an owner-inspired modification to the as-cast finish on the owner-added Z/28 valve covers (the same ones used on the Corvette). The current GM replacements are polished, but they were never that way in production. Only the chrome air cleaner lid is correct, and all L48's had painted stamped steel valve covers.
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« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2006, 12:20:20 PM »

AHHH...........Yes........

The elusive undocumented "bright engine accents" option........ Huh

JohnZ is right...never happened.
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69OlympicGoldSS
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« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2006, 09:32:34 PM »

Gentlemen,

So help me out here.  Take a look again at the picture I originally posted.  The guy who originally bought this car was a GM service manager and owned this car from when it was new in early 1970 until he died in 2003.  Now that I have read your other comments I am wondering if the valve covers and air cleaner currently on the car were original or perhaps non original but NOS GM parts?  The original owner surely had access to some goodies as the GM service manager.

Any comments would e sincerely appreciated.
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KurtS
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« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2006, 12:10:44 AM »

Neither part is original to the car.
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Kurt S
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69OlympicGoldSS
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« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2006, 03:44:31 PM »

What model / vintage GM would you say the valve covers and air cleaner appear to be?
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« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2006, 03:51:34 PM »

I'd say that the air cleaner top appears to be Cal Custom or an equivalent after-market replacement type.  Just by looking at the picture, I don't believe that it ever had a GM mark on it.
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gro51
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« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2006, 08:01:54 PM »

That air cleaner doesn't appear to me to be anything GM ever put on an engine.  I guess the vave covers are debatable.  I think those would be correct for a '69 Camaro 350, but JOHNZ disagrees.  I find it hard to believe that a '67 and '68 350 SS Camaro would have both chrome air cleaner lid and chrome valve covers and that a '69 would suddenly have a chrome air cleaner lid and  painted stamped steel valve covers. Huh
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Joe
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69OlympicGoldSS
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« Reply #17 on: November 12, 2006, 08:57:25 PM »

<<shows a few pictures of a supposed original '69 SS 350 and it looks to me to have a chrome air cleaner lid as well as the polished finned aluminum valve covers. >>

No '69 ever had polished finned aluminum valve covers - that's an owner-inspired modification to the as-cast finish on the owner-added Z/28 valve covers (the same ones used on the Corvette). The current GM replacements are polished, but they were never that way in production. Only the chrome air cleaner lid is correct, and all L48's had painted stamped steel valve covers.

Ok, so you are saying these are Z-28 or vette valve covers.  I would agree that the air cleaner doesn't appear to be a GM part, based on photos I have seen.

Thanks to alll for your input.
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« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2006, 11:51:06 AM »

I guess the vave covers are debatable.  I think those would be correct for a '69 Camaro 350, but JOHNZ disagrees.  I find it hard to believe that a '67 and '68 350 SS Camaro would have both chrome air cleaner lid and chrome valve covers and that a '69 would suddenly have a chrome air cleaner lid and  painted stamped steel valve covers. Huh

There is no debate on the valve covers - that's the way it was; the only production Camaro application for those finned aluminum valve covers was the Z/28. However, they were available over-the-counter as service parts, and lots of folks bought them and installed them themselves. Note the oil fill tube extension on the driver's side valve cover in the photo - that's an aftermarket addition of some sort.
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« Reply #19 on: March 30, 2008, 11:20:55 AM »

If those are real no dripper 69 valve covers they are valuable!
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James
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« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2008, 12:10:40 AM »

Here is a pic of my original air cleaner for a 69 SS350
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Chris
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« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2008, 09:34:01 AM »

the valve covers are z-28/corvette 1969 till whenever. the air cleaner looks aftermarket. i have never seen one like it on a camaro.pull off a valve cover and see if there are drippers inside. drippers would be 70 and up.
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« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2008, 10:44:15 AM »

The air cleaner looks aftermarket to me. i can only see one valve cover and it appears to be dull, which doesnt mean anything. the valve covers look GM. They will have a part number cast into them on the inside and either they will have drippers or not.
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69redrsss
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« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2009, 12:47:53 PM »

Per my Nov. 1969 printing Camaro Master Parts Catalogue the 350 & 302 shared the same valve covers in '67 & '68 (chrome it would appear from all pictures you can find).  However, in 1969 the 350 shared the same (painted) covers as the other small blocks with the left one with an oil fill added to it.  Only the 302 is listed with unique part numbers.  My parent's '69 had a L48 and it was as the Camaro parts cataloque suggests.  This was a station wagon so no one likely modified it in the one year the original owner had this car before my parents bought it. This suggests to me that any chrome valve covers were either added by the dealer, non-documented by GM or the documenation was never retained. 
To add to the confusion (for myself at least) my (restored about 10 years ago by someone else) '69 L48 has chrome covers exactly like those in '68 but the left one has the revised oil fill which was added in '69 to the painted covers.  My car was built near the end of the '69 production run.  I am never the less changing back to painted units I found after a long long search.
As for air cleaners there are two 4BBL small block parts listed for 1969 with the second one apparently added later. Since there is only one air cleaner element part listed for non-cowl 350s physically they should be the same.  Unfortunately, it doesn't say whether the new part was chrome. A check of other cataloques (Nova & Chevelle owners claim to have had the same chrome option for their SS equipped L48s) may help clarify.   I may have no documented proof (other than numerous pictures) but I would say that any original chrome lids were most likely exactly the same as a non-chrome lid.  I have yet to see a reproduction of either painted or chrome with the correct profile (bump on the top of the lid where the element sits).

 
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Les
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« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2009, 02:12:22 PM »

This is from a Nova site, taken in 1969. This is how all manual trans L48 Camaro [exc ZL2] and Nova engines would have appeared. One slight difference may be the overspray on the manifolds; probably a Tonawanda engine.

« Last Edit: October 24, 2009, 06:02:53 PM by william » Logged
69redrsss
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« Reply #25 on: October 24, 2009, 05:56:44 PM »

Good picture of the air cleaner top.  Do you know the original source? I've seen this picture before but didn't notice the overspray like supposedly happened to big blocks.  I have also seen some pictures showing the same Tonawanda sticker on the rad end of the other valve cover.  This is of interest to me because my engine came from that plant. As you can see from these pictures the stickers were not added to pristine rebuilt engines. I've attached two pictures (one with the valve covers switched but if the cover was the correct right side the stcikers would have the same placement).  The last picture is of a L48 chrome top which actually looks like it may be original and not just a show engine. Sorry for drifting off the original topic.
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Les
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« Reply #26 on: October 24, 2009, 10:20:48 PM »

/Users/johnbateman/Desktop/index.php.jpeg/Users/johnbateman/Desktop/index.php.png
I don't know if these pics will post but Kurt and John are right I went through this 1 year ago and was helped out on this sight. My SS 69 convertible l48 looks just like these pics to a t and there are no decent repos out there for sale.
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miket1
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« Reply #27 on: November 21, 2009, 09:16:18 PM »

Apparently GM went to painted valve covers to save a few bucks, I remember when I saw the first new 69 SS 350 arrive at the dealer back then, it just didn't look right for an SS Camaro to have painted valve covers, we were used to seeing chrome. The local speed shop was doing well selling  chrome valve covers and open element air cleaners .
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69 Z28
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« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2009, 10:10:24 AM »

My original unmolested 69 L48 has the chrome air cleaner top and painted valve covers.
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69redrsss
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« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2009, 10:24:19 PM »

Can you tell me when your car was built and where? If anyone else could provide similar info for their L48 (as well as whether it had a chrome top or not) it may help sort out whether there was a cut-off date for the chrome topped units.  As the '68 SS350 air cleaner top looks identical it might have been a "while supplies last" part for the '69 350SS/L48.

The attached 69 Nova SS ad shows the chrome topped air cleaner for an automatic equipped car.
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Les
'69 Garnet Red TH350 SS350 RS
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« Reply #30 on: November 24, 2009, 01:11:50 AM »

Can you tell me when your car was built and where? If anyone else could provide similar info for their L48 (as well as whether it had a chrome top or not) it may help sort out whether there was a cut-off date for the chrome topped units.
I'm missing something. Is there some evidence that not all the L48's in 69 all had chrome air cleaners??
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Kurt S
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« Reply #31 on: November 25, 2009, 12:05:52 AM »

Kurt - I've been referring to '69s not '68s which had a unique air cleaner part number that was chrome as per all the evidence I have seen.  However, with so many original '69 owners claiming to have painted lids, what would possess them to replace them with painted ones? As you are already likely aware Chevrolet factory assembly & parts catalogues show '69 350 4bbls (LM1 & L48) with the same air cleaner part number. In 07?/68 the part number changed and it looks like at the same time the reference to LM1 was added. Was this a possible transition from chrome to painted?  I can't tell because my parts catalogue doesn't list the old part number 6484582. So unless both were chrome (I appreciate the CRG site has an LM1 picture with a chrome top on top of very rusty bottom). I'd say I'm yet to be convinced since I've also seen an original LM1 barn find with a painted lid. If you have documented or strong evidence to the contrary that would help put the arguement to rest.  However, what do you do with all the non-chrome L48s?  It just seems to be an inconsistent practice as to whether the factory installed them or not - at least in 1969.
Les
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Les
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« Reply #32 on: November 25, 2009, 03:02:06 PM »

Don't look at parts manuals to try and determine what came from the factory on cars.  The Factory hardware and Service parts hardware are almost always a different animal.  When a new car was produced (or changed) the the Service parts group went thru all the engineered parts and determined what they needed to carry, and what they already had that would be functionally equivalent.  If an existing black air cleaner lid from a 68 would work on a 69 that should have had a chrome onefrom the factory, the parts group would just list the black one in the parts manuals as being applicable to the new car.  That way they did not have to stock every single nut and bolt for the car.  As time went on over the years the parts kept getting thinned out with more and more functional parts and less correct parts.
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Mark C.
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« Reply #33 on: November 25, 2009, 08:49:15 PM »

What you say may be the actual case but it makes it very difficult to prove a restoration is back to its factory/showroom condition. If they ran out of chrome lids it might be evidenced by painted lids after a certain build date.   
Les
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Les
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« Reply #34 on: November 26, 2009, 09:19:04 AM »

Servce parts were never used at the factory, The divisions are totally separate.
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Mark C.
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« Reply #35 on: November 26, 2009, 11:02:30 AM »

What you say may be the actual case but it makes it very difficult to prove a restoration is back to its factory/showroom condition. If they ran out of chrome lids it might be evidenced by painted lids after a certain build date.   
Les

What you say is true but not always relevant. The term "restoration" means different things to different people.
Did the factory build cars using the wrong parts some times? - Yes! 
Were they supposed to do that? - No.

Restoration for a particular car can mean that a car is returned to it's original "as delivered" condition with any non-spec parts OR does it mean "returned to normative practice" with all the correct specified parts.
Normative practice is more like what the factory should have built given the time and proper specified parts.  "As Delivered" might mean the car had some parts that were not exactly per spec but that is what that particular car had leaving the factory.

If you do not have any STRONG physical evidence IN YOUR HANDS to show others that a particular car was delivered with parts that were not correct "normative practice" you are shoveling sand into the ocean. There is no real reason for anyone to accept that these incorrect parts are original for that car.

The car in question has numerous aftermarket replacement parts all over the engine bay. it is not possible to say with any certainty how much of this example is "original to the car" but we can determine if the parts and pieces are aftermarket or "normative practice" from research, casting numbers and date codes etc. Thats about all we can ever know.

-Mark.
 
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69redrsss
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« Reply #36 on: November 26, 2009, 02:56:02 PM »

Simplistically, where
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Les
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« Reply #37 on: November 26, 2009, 10:36:01 PM »

Sorry for my last reply - my link crashed.
I just want to have some way to prove that my car is close to showroom/factory floor condition once I'm done.  I'm trying to use documentation as proof.  Even with documentation people debate like has been happening here.
Although there may be some exceptions, my July 1969 printing of the Camaro Master Parts Cataloque almost always lines up with the factory assembly manual - at least where I have looked so far.  The SS350/L48 chrome lid seems to be an unusual exception. I'm hoping other members can help fill in the documentation gap.
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Les
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« Reply #38 on: November 27, 2009, 07:53:53 AM »

For what it's worth , my 69 L48 has a build date of 01B.
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crobjones2
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« Reply #39 on: November 29, 2009, 12:15:45 PM »

  However, with so many original '69 owners claiming to have painted lids, what would possess them to replace them with painted ones?

I don't see any owners claiming to have painted air cleaner lids.

For the record - I have a 06A SS350(L48) with almost all of the original parts. I have the painted valve covers and the chrome air cleaner.
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Chris
69 SS 350
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« Reply #40 on: November 29, 2009, 04:20:26 PM »

Thanks Chris for the info on your car. I came upon the inconsistency looking for info on correct valve covers & air cleaner to finish restoring my 08A L48 with a TH350.  I found about 30-40% of original owners claiming to have never had a chrome air cleaner.  I didn't keep stats (I now see I should have). That % range is hard to ignore. If you have a chrome air cleaner it likely sounds odd because it matches Chev practices on other SS350 '69 models (Nova SS for example) as well as the '68 Camaro L48. Specific posts (any forum) on the issue are also rare. I usually stumbled upon the info looking for something else L48 related.
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Les
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« Reply #41 on: November 30, 2009, 02:11:48 AM »

Every original L48 and LM1 air cleaner that I've seen has had the chrome lid (non-cowl hood). This includes factory pics and original road tests.
The chrome lid was directly referenced in the ordering info for the L48 and that never changed throughout the year.

I've been at this for a while and there are others (William, JohnZ, etc) that have been doing it even longer. I'm not hearing the support for the black lid from them, nor am I seeing any supporting data for the black lid in this thread. Data will help generate more discussion.

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Kurt S
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« Reply #42 on: November 30, 2009, 11:11:49 PM »

I respect that all of you have been chasing these issues much longer than I. However, if all '69 L48s were equipped as such there are a significant number of false claims out there.  It would take a lot of time to re-gather my references but I may try to do it.
Is it possible that they were originally intended to be equipped that way but due to high demand and/or the extended '69 model run that the factory substituted periodically or near the end of the model run?
If you are willing to send me the ordering reference to this I'd really appreciate it. I'm just trying to sort out for my own car.
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Les
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« Reply #43 on: December 01, 2009, 10:04:23 AM »

The various order forms and price lists throughout the year show that the 69 Camaro SS included 'bright engine accents' or '....350 engine with bright accents'. As was discussed above, the valve covers were painted, leaving only the chrome air cleaner as an 'accent'.
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Kurt S
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« Reply #44 on: December 01, 2009, 12:58:32 PM »

I found and posted here or at Camaros.net several '69 option sheets / advertizements in books like CAMARO 1967-1969 Fact Book by Dobbins, et al, and Michael Lamm's the Great Camaro. On page 47 he shows air intake inlets on a 1968 Rally Sport, and the bright engine accents on page 54...these guys were real pioneers in trying to document this stuff early on- but they natuarally did not always get it right- so if people of enhanced knowledge and a myriad of research done, it is most likely correct. Kinda like "this movie based on a true story"...how much is true???  Kurt, Jerry M and JohnZ havethis stuff pretty well pinned down.


The various order forms and price lists throughout the year show that the 69 Camaro SS included 'bright engine accents' or '....350 engine with bright accents'. As was discussed above, the valve covers were painted, leaving only the chrome air cleaner as an 'accent'.
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Rob
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« Reply #45 on: December 03, 2009, 12:39:19 AM »

Here's an example of a post from an original owner claiming to have a painted lid.  I'll stop posting on the painted lid topic.
http://forums.hemmings.com/viewtopic.php?p=7706&sid=b121a93267c6f2654bce2a460ff473d5

I've attached a picture of my engine.  I appreciate that the valve covers & air cleaner are not original (in the process of being changed) but someone went to the effort to find a part to cover the upper heat stove opening when the original heat stove pipe was removed.  If someone knows where it came from I'd sure like to know because it looks very original/GM like. It's not something a non-OEM supplier would likely even bother with.  Is it from one of those dealer dress-up kits some talk about?
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Les
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« Reply #46 on: January 16, 2010, 07:24:23 PM »

i have a Nov 68 built 69 camaro RS/SS. it had a chrome air cleaner lid on the original air cleaner. i also have a copy from GM canada of the build/option sheet for my car and it does NOT have any reference to a chrome lid or dress up option.
does anyone have a RPO for this option in 69? or even what it would say on a build sheet, as some of you allude to here?

Kurt and John Z are camaro gurus as far as what should have been on cars from the factory. they have been at this a long time and i would bow to there expertise any day of the week.

the only thing that could now but this to rest as far as black air cleaner lids VS chrome is build dates of camaro's. im with john and kurt on this one tho, the L48 SS camaro's all had chrome lids and painted valve covers. thats all ive ever seen on factory air cleaners on camaro's and nova's over the years. ive owned my camaro for 31 years now.
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« Reply #47 on: March 11, 2011, 08:17:58 PM »

There was some skepticism as to whether L48 always came with a chrome air cleaner lid.  Did this exclude reference to the Cowl Induction cars?  My May 69 SS 350 Cowl car has a black air cleaner lid... and while I'd like it to be chrome, I think black painted was correct.

anyone?


Gary
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Gary 9T4Z

94Z rag blower 491 rwhp (now 505!)
69 Pace Car, 70RS,91Z,91RS
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« Reply #48 on: March 12, 2011, 12:04:53 AM »

Gary
if you have an original SS cowl induction car.....im guessing yours is a 69 pace car? ...you would have a Black air cleaner lid.  Wink
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