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Author Topic: Sinkhole in the Corvette Museum  (Read 2755 times)
cook_dw
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« on: February 12, 2014, 09:59:03 AM »



http://www.newschannel5.com/story/24702447/sinkhole-collapses-part-of-corvette-museum-in-bowling-green

http://www.bgdailynews.com/news/collapse-at-national-corvette-museum-sends-cars-into-sinkhole/article_773f14c0-d55e-5925-9361-29635b40349f.html
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Darrell Cook

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« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2014, 10:18:08 AM »

Bummer! Thought that stuff only happened in Florida. Hopefully, the cars can be saved.  And, hopefully, John is still smiling....
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« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2014, 10:27:12 AM »

Bowling Green and practically all of south central KY has caves under it.  There have been several sinkholes pop up over the years.  There was one when I was living there that dropped out on a new section of road that had been opened about a year.  Took 2 cars with it.  It was very close to the Lost River Cave in BG.
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Darrell Cook

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« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2014, 10:43:49 AM »

from one of the NCM employees:

"The following is what I know about cars involved:
We received a call at 5:44am from our security company alerting us of our motion detectors going off in our Sk...ydome area of the Museum. Upon arrival it was discovered that a sinkhole had collapsed within the Museum. No one was in or around the Museum at the time. The Bowling Green Fire Department arrived on the scene and secured the area.
It is with heavy hearts that we report that eight Corvettes were affected by this incident. Those cars include:
• 1993 ZR-1 Spyder on loan from General Motors • 2009 ZR1 “Blue Devil” on loan from General Motors The other six vehicles were owned by the National Corvette Museum including:
• 1962 Black Corvette
• 1984 PPG Pace Car
• 1992 White 1 Millionth Corvette
• 1993 Ruby Red 40th Anniversary Corvette
• 2001 Mallett Hammer Z06 Corvette
• 2009 White 1.5 Millionth Corvette
None of the cars affected were on loan from individuals. We have contacted a structural engineer who is arriving today to assess the existing damage and stability of the surrounding areas. While the Skydome area is closed, the remainder of the Museum is still open"

This list includes mostly 'one of one' Corvettes..  including the 'One Millionth Corvette' built, a white / red '92 Corvette that I saw being built back in '92, which was celebrated with a huge 'to-do' at the NCM and plant...
PS.  Just remembered that the current NCM wasn't opened until 1994; the 'ncm' in 1992 was at a small location in a local BG shopping center.. Smiley  
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« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2014, 12:45:26 PM »

Pics coming in Shocked:
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« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2014, 07:24:35 PM »

looks like a black 59 in your pic, I did't see any mention of that one.
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« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2014, 07:59:26 PM »

looks like a black 59 in your pic, I did't see any mention of that one.

Thats a 62.
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Darrell Cook

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« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2014, 09:47:15 PM »

my mistake, thank you.
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« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2014, 10:03:10 PM »

Some videos: http://www.autoblog.com/2014/02/12/national-corvette-museum-sinkhole-security-camera-footage/
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« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2014, 12:23:02 AM »

Holy giant mole, Batman...





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« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2014, 01:37:25 AM »

That's brutal. Should have been the Ford Museum, or the Hugger Orange Museum.....Relax I'm only kidding
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« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2014, 03:11:18 AM »

or the Hugger Orange Museum.....Relax I'm only kidding
Course you are; can only think of one guy that'd pay to go visit that one Smiley

Very sad to see those unique cars damaged/lost like that.......
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Tim - New South Wales, Australia
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« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2014, 07:47:05 AM »

Jeez! That video is hard to watch. Does anyone really believe they can retrieve any of those cars? Or, will it just be a grave site with a memorial??   Embarrassed
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« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2014, 09:32:54 AM »

Jeez! That video is hard to watch. Does anyone really believe they can retrieve any of those cars? Or, will it just be a grave site with a memorial??   Embarrassed

I'm told that the Kentucky EPA prohibits leaving them in there due to the gas/oil in them (although I'm not sure that the lowest ones could be retrieved.. and they may determine that it's too dangerous to hook onto them to retrieve them).  Personally I hope they find a means to get the top ones out, and hopefully, if safety isn't an issue, then retrieve them all to be restored.  The only means I can conceive of how to retrieve them would be to disassemble a portion of the yellow dome, and use a crane to hook them and lift them out.   If they were mine, I'd sure go down there and hook them up (with appropriate safety cable/harnesses).. Smiley
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« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2014, 09:46:38 AM »

Tragedy to say the least.
What's the story of the '62 Corvette?
Why is this one here?
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« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2014, 10:44:54 AM »

Jeez! That video is hard to watch. Does anyone really believe they can retrieve any of those cars? Or, will it just be a grave site with a memorial??   Embarrassed

I'm told that the Kentucky EPA prohibits leaving them in there due to the gas/oil in them (although I'm not sure that the lowest ones could be retrieved.. and they may determine that it's too dangerous to hook onto them to retrieve them).  Personally I hope they find a means to get the top ones out, and hopefully, if safety isn't an issue, then retrieve them all to be restored.  The only means I can conceive of how to retrieve them would be to disassemble a portion of the yellow dome, and use a crane to hook them and lift them out.   If they were mine, I'd sure go down there and hook them up (with appropriate safety cable/harnesses).. Smiley

I wonder if they keep only a few gallons in the tank at the museum? When we display cars at our convention center, they want them as close to empty as possible.  Anyway, one or more of those cars are bound to leak gas and fumes.
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Phillip
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« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2014, 11:44:37 AM »

Tragedy to say the least.
What's the story of the '62 Corvette?
Why is this one here?
The '62 was donated to the Museum by the 'only owner it ever had'.   The previous owner (before the NCM) bought it new while in high school, using money he'd earned..  Had it all those years, then wanted it to be preserved somewhere it could be enjoyed by many; it was said he would never drive it in the rain while he owned it, and if he had it out on the road, was constantly observing the weather, so he could dash home before any bad weather (ie. rain) happened.. Smiley   Unfortunate for that car.. and I'm hoping it can be saved and restored (for the original owner's sake)...
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« Reply #17 on: February 13, 2014, 12:14:23 PM »

Are we sure this is legit? It really looks like one of my sons threw a couple Matchboxes in a sandbox hole... The more I see the pics, the more sick I get. I saw a story where a museum rep said they might add the cars to a survivor exhibit that shows cars that survived tragic events like this. Consipiriacy theories anyone? Big marketing gimmick to get people to the museum?
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« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2014, 12:43:36 PM »

Are we sure this is legit? It really looks like one of my sons threw a couple Matchboxes in a sandbox hole... The more I see the pics, the more sick I get. I saw a story where a museum rep said they might add the cars to a survivor exhibit that shows cars that survived tragic events like this. Consipiriacy theories anyone? Big marketing gimmick to get people to the museum?
No, it's REAL..   TOO real...  still an on-going situation being reported on all over the country..  CNN  ..  USA Today...  etc..
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
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« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2014, 12:52:15 PM »

There is a reason central Kentucky is called cave country.   Wink  It may be solid ground 30 or 50ft and then there would be a hole from an unknown branch of a cave system and all it takes is weight and erosion.   Id be willing to bet that this will ultimately be explored.  They'll almost have to verify that there isnt more of these pockets under the museum.
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Darrell Cook

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« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2014, 01:51:09 PM »

Are we sure this is legit? It really looks like one of my sons threw a couple Matchboxes in a sandbox hole... The more I see the pics, the more sick I get. I saw a story where a museum rep said they might add the cars to a survivor exhibit that shows cars that survived tragic events like this. Consipiriacy theories anyone? Big marketing gimmick to get people to the museum?
No, it's REAL..   TOO real...  still an on-going situation being reported on all over the country..  CNN  ..  USA Today...  etc..
I was just kidding around Gary lol
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« Reply #21 on: February 13, 2014, 01:55:57 PM »

Are we sure this is legit? It really looks like one of my sons threw a couple Matchboxes in a sandbox hole... The more I see the pics, the more sick I get. I saw a story where a museum rep said they might add the cars to a survivor exhibit that shows cars that survived tragic events like this. Consipiriacy theories anyone? Big marketing gimmick to get people to the museum?
No, it's REAL..   TOO real...  still an on-going situation being reported on all over the country..  CNN  ..  USA Today...  etc..
I was just kidding around Gary lol
Just prior to that pic, those cars were parked on a "grassy knoll"lol.
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« Reply #22 on: February 13, 2014, 03:03:28 PM »

There is a reason central Kentucky is called cave country.   Wink  It may be solid ground 30 or 50ft and then there would be a hole from an unknown branch of a cave system and all it takes is weight and erosion.   Id be willing to bet that this will ultimately be explored.  They'll almost have to verify that there isnt more of these pockets under the museum.

You can tell from the pictures that there are caverns that go on down.  Gary may be right.  They may have to demolish the Skydome and start all over again.  Sad state of affairs....
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Phillip
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« Reply #23 on: February 13, 2014, 05:02:43 PM »

I can tell ya right now I would volunteer to get lowered down there tomorrow if I could. I remember in 86' I was working on an off shore oil rig 7 days a week 12 hours a day. We were building it for Chevron. After completion to haul it away they had one of two of the biggest pieces of Eq. I had ever seen. One was one of two cranes that are the largest in the world. The other was a carrier out of japan, also one of the biggest in the world. They lifted that sucker up and put it on the carrier like it was a bag of candy. I think it was in two pieces, but still. Of course they wouldn't need THAT crane, but why would you leave ANY of them down there. Hook them up and pull them out one at a time. What's the problem. They make chain and cable plenty long enough. Have them contact me if they want someone to be lowered in the hole ... Danny
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« Reply #24 on: February 13, 2014, 08:30:55 PM »

Chevy will oversee the restoration of all 8 cars.

http://www.4-traders.com/GENERAL-MOTORS-COMPANY-6873535/news/General-Motors-Company--Chevrolet-to-Oversee-Restoration-of-Damaged-Vintage-Corvettes-17947941/
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« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2014, 11:06:31 PM »

I can tell ya right now I would volunteer to get lowered down there tomorrow if I could. I remember in 86' I was working on an off shore oil rig 7 days a week 12 hours a day. We were building it for Chevron. After completion to haul it away they had one of two of the biggest pieces of Eq. I had ever seen. One was one of two cranes that are the largest in the world. The other was a carrier out of japan, also one of the biggest in the world. They lifted that sucker up and put it on the carrier like it was a bag of candy. I think it was in two pieces, but still. Of course they wouldn't need THAT crane, but why would you leave ANY of them down there. Hook them up and pull them out one at a time. What's the problem. They make chain and cable plenty long enough. Have them contact me if they want someone to be lowered in the hole ... Danny
I can tell ya right now I would volunteer to get lowered down there tomorrow if I could. I remember in 86' I was working on an off shore oil rig 7 days a week 12 hours a day. We were building it for Chevron. After completion to haul it away they had one of two of the biggest pieces of Eq. I had ever seen. One was one of two cranes that are the largest in the world. The other was a carrier out of japan, also one of the biggest in the world. They lifted that sucker up and put it on the carrier like it was a bag of candy. I think it was in two pieces, but still. Of course they wouldn't need THAT crane, but why would you leave ANY of them down there. Hook them up and pull them out one at a time. What's the problem. They make chain and cable plenty long enough. Have them contact me if they want someone to be lowered in the hole ... Danny

I've sent your username here on CRG to Wendell (director of the NCM); I'm sure he will be signing in here to get you to sign the 'waivers' required...  Smiley   (J/K)..
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« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2014, 11:35:19 PM »

Hate to be a Debbie Downer but I'll bet about half of those Vettes won't be recovered. Too dangerous, sinkholes are extremely unstable and the cars not shown in the pics look like they are under tons of dirt and concrete. RIP
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« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2014, 11:50:49 PM »

Awesome!! I hope you are not kidding, I am ready. I will let ya know how my training and harness fitting goes.... Danny
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« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2014, 06:05:16 AM »

Awesome!! I hope you are not kidding, I am ready. I will let ya know how my training and harness fitting goes.... Danny

If anyone can get what it takes (resource wise) to extract the cars out of the hole it is Mark Reuss.

When the cars are recovered, they will be shipped to the Mechanical Assembly facility over at GM design where an individualized restoration approach will be determined for each car.   Some cars will likely require entire body replacement to repair.   

Mechanical Assembly restores the vehicles in the GM Heritage Collection and GM’s historic concept cars, so they know how to resurrect the dead so to speak.
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« Reply #29 on: February 14, 2014, 08:50:08 AM »

 Some cars will likely require entire body replacement to repair.  Mechanical Assembly restores the vehicles in the GM Heritage Collection and GM’s historic concept cars, so they know how to resurrect the dead so to speak.[/quote]

I know it's an old debate, but at what point is it not the same car and can you still call it the 1 millionth for instance? Where is the "heart" of the car. The drive train? Maybe. A completely rebodied car to me can be a nice car, but it isn't the same car as before. It's a new one.
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« Reply #30 on: February 14, 2014, 09:10:25 AM »

Some cars will likely require entire body replacement to repair.  Mechanical Assembly restores the vehicles in the GM Heritage Collection and GM’s historic concept cars, so they know how to resurrect the dead so to speak.

I know it's an old debate, but at what point is it not the same car and can you still call it the 1 millionth for instance? Where is the "heart" of the car. The drive train? Maybe. A completely rebodied car to me can be a nice car, but it isn't the same car as before. It's a new one.
[/quote]



Good question.. likely moot since GM built both. Huh
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« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2014, 11:10:14 AM »

Here's yesterday afternoon's press conference from the Museum:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M84BJC6r37o
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« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2014, 12:02:45 PM »

Very good!   Makes me feel a bit better.. and I just hope everything goes according to plan.

Thanks for posting that link JohnZ.. Smiley
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« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2014, 12:11:33 PM »

http://www.4-traders.com/GENERAL-MOTORS-COMPANY-6873535/news/General-Motors-Company--Chevrolet-to-Oversee-Restoration-of-Damaged-Vintage-Corvettes-17947941/
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« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2014, 06:59:37 PM »

Progress!  They got two of the cars out of the sinkhole. News tonight showed first one starting.
First Out...
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« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2014, 07:17:55 PM »

Phil, saw that on the news. I wonder why they didn't take the '62 out first, appeared to be easiest.
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« Reply #36 on: March 03, 2014, 07:25:45 PM »

I was thinking if they moved the blue car they could move the 62 so it was level and then take it out.
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« Reply #37 on: March 03, 2014, 10:16:24 PM »

Phil, saw that on the news. I wonder why they didn't take the '62 out first, appeared to be easiest.
I was thinking if they moved the blue car they could move the 62 so it was level and then take it out.

Makes sense to me. No telling what they are facing down in the hole.
Couldn't tell much from the video and the news pictures, but the Blue Devil didn't look too bad.  Hope they have good luck with the rest!

Video of the second one... It has more damage showing. Pretty sad...  but restoreable!

Local News Report... Shows the start up and drive out of the Blue Devil (hope not too far, note the leak as it drives out), second car has more damage, and says they'll try the 62 tomorrow.
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« Reply #38 on: March 04, 2014, 09:02:59 AM »

Phil, saw that on the news. I wonder why they didn't take the '62 out first, appeared to be easiest.

Because the black '62 has a 5-ton slab of concrete leaning on it - they have to deal with the car AND the slab, without damaging the car any further. It will come out today (Tuesday).
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« Reply #39 on: March 04, 2014, 09:07:32 AM »

John ,
I noticed in the videos that they are pulling the cars out by strapping to the wheels.  Is that a strong point structurally?
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« Reply #40 on: March 04, 2014, 12:03:44 PM »

The wheels better be able to hold the weight of the car!
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« Reply #41 on: March 04, 2014, 12:15:38 PM »

The wheels better be able to hold the weight of the car!

Exactly!  Shocked
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Phillip
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« Reply #42 on: March 04, 2014, 06:00:26 PM »

Did anyone else notice how little rebar there is in the concrete? BIG slabs fell in with no rebar in sight, as if nothing was tied together.
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Doug  '67 RS/SS 396 auto I know the car since new
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« Reply #43 on: March 04, 2014, 06:44:35 PM »

I did notice that. After having tied rebar together for years it seamed strange I couldn't make out any in the pic. It seems as the years have gone by they have required the rebar to closer and tighter together and more of it. Also on some of the larger jobs I was involved in, (one of which was about the same size as the museum they required a separate Storm sewer based on the square footage of the building and water run off. You could have parked 3 cars in the storm sewer, it was huge. This was built about 1996 in washington state. I am not sure what year the museum was built, but I assume it was up to local code.
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1969 garnet red Z/28 46k mile unrestored X77
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« Reply #44 on: March 04, 2014, 06:54:46 PM »

Did anyone else notice how little rebar there is in the concrete? BIG slabs fell in with no rebar in sight, as if nothing was tied together.

I know that fiberglass is used in slabs in lieu of re-bar to give the concrete strength, which may be the case with this slab...after all fiberglass is a Corvette thing,right?
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Putting you First...Keeps me First. Talent on loan from God. Helping the hobbyist and exposing the fraud
1969 SS/RS 396 coupe Hugger Orange X22 712 bought in 79
1969 SS 350 coupe LeMans Blue 713 bought in 79
1969 307 4spd. coupe Daytona Yellow 711 bought in 85
68 Ragtop
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« Reply #45 on: March 04, 2014, 07:29:01 PM »

I am not sure why they thought it would be a good idea to start and drive the car before thoroughly checking it out, but they probably won't try that a second time. Look at the massive oil leak when they drive off. Probably shut it off just in time before running dry.
Don't these cars have a low oil pressure warning?

Jump right to 2:15

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hzJ9RQn_58&list=UUkMEB53zhxtxbijEVl2YeWA&feature=share&index=8


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69Z28-RS
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« Reply #46 on: March 04, 2014, 10:15:24 PM »

I did notice that. After having tied rebar together for years it seamed strange I couldn't make out any in the pic. It seems as the years have gone by they have required the rebar to closer and tighter together and more of it. Also on some of the larger jobs I was involved in, (one of which was about the same size as the museum they required a separate Storm sewer based on the square footage of the building and water run off. You could have parked 3 cars in the storm sewer, it was huge. This was built about 1996 in washington state. I am not sure what year the museum was built, but I assume it was up to local code.

I've been concerned and wondering about the construction of that slab since the day it fell into the sinkhole.  The slab itself didn't seem to be structural, but I was also surprised no rebar or wire in the slab (or at least none noticeable).  'So called' fiberglass strands in concrete is a 'gimmick' to get around rebar or wire mesh (IMO).   I have no idea what the code was in Kentucky when the Museum was built between 1992 and 1994.
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
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« Reply #47 on: April 10, 2014, 07:12:12 AM »

Last one pulled out yesterday, sad Sad   https://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/last-corvette-pulled-from-museum-sinkhole-will-need-some-extra-tlc-212950216.html 
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Putting you First...Keeps me First. Talent on loan from God. Helping the hobbyist and exposing the fraud
1969 SS/RS 396 coupe Hugger Orange X22 712 bought in 79
1969 SS 350 coupe LeMans Blue 713 bought in 79
1969 307 4spd. coupe Daytona Yellow 711 bought in 85
Mark
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« Reply #48 on: April 10, 2014, 09:50:57 AM »

Thats the 2001 Mallett Hammer.  It will probably buff right out, no problem.



Before:

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Mark C.
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« Reply #49 on: April 10, 2014, 10:07:06 AM »

Wonder if there are sinkholes waiting to open up under the I-65 which runs very close to the Museum .....  Huh




Jim
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« Reply #50 on: April 10, 2014, 11:23:59 AM »

Why are they displaying them until August? Trying to bring in the folks who love to see wrecks at races?
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Phillip
HNR-AACA, Senior Master
Planning 2016 Sentimental Tour, AACA (and restoring a 40 Buick Special for it)
AACA Southeastern Division Spring Meet Chair
"Charlotte AutoFair, presented by the Hornets Nest Region, AACA, is the largest and greatest Collector Vehicle Event in the Southeast USA."
69Z28-RS
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« Reply #51 on: April 10, 2014, 01:02:41 PM »

Why are they displaying them until August? Trying to bring in the folks who love to see wrecks at races?

in late August (leading up to Labor Day weekend event) will occur the 20th anniversary of the NCM grand opening, and the National Caravan to it.  I think they will have the cars on display thru that event for all the Corvette enthusiasts visiting and attending that weekend.  I will be driving one of my Corvettes in the Caravan also, as I also drove in the two prior Caravans to the NCM.. The Caravans were 'nationwide' events, with caravans beginning as long as a week in advance in the far reached of the country, then adding cars as they got closer to the NCM..   The First One (for the NCM grand opening) was amazing, as the Governor of Kentucky at the time CLOSED interstate 65 thru Kentucky for the Caravan.. we were the only cars on the Interstate that day... Smiley     It was neat, but there were so many PO'ed truckers and other travelers that were surprised by this, I don't think it will ever happen again.. Smiley

Gary
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
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