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Author Topic: Are these ex-Trans Am Camaros racing at multiple Daytona 24 hour races?  (Read 4522 times)
SMKZ28
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« on: January 13, 2013, 05:44:22 PM »

Does anyone know if this is an ex-trans am Camaro?  This picture was taken at the 24 hour Pepsi Challenge at Daytona International Speedway on February 3, 1980.  I found the picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "This Chevrolet Camaro was driven in the 24 Hour Pepsi Challenge at Daytona International Speedway by Dick Neland, Bill Ferran and Joe Cotrone. The team dropped out of the race after completing 270 laps." (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)  The picture can be seen here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/february-3-1980-this-chevrolet-camaro-was-driven-in-the-24-news-photo/155717880
« Last Edit: January 13, 2013, 06:40:03 PM by SMKZ28 » Logged
SMKZ28
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2013, 06:30:54 PM »

Is this an ex-trans am Camaro?  I also found this picture in the ISC Archives at Getty Images.  The caption states, "February 2, 1975: Maurice “Mo” Carter pits his Chevrolet Camaro during the 24 Hours of Daytona at Daytona International Speedway. Carter co-drove the car with Gene Felton, but the team dropped out due to damage from a crash on lap 346 and was scored in 30th position. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/february-2-1975-maurice-mo-carter-pits-his-chevrolet-news-photo/139063221
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2013, 06:37:48 PM »

Is this an ex-trans am Camaro?  I also found this picture in the ISC Archives at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL - 1975: John Greenwood's Chevrolet Corvette leads a Chevrolet Camaro during an IMSA GT event at Daytona International Speedway. (ISC Archives Photo via Getty Images)"  More info can be seen here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/john-greenwoods-chevrolet-corvette-leads-a-chevrolet-camaro-news-photo/132706273
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2013, 06:43:33 PM »

Is this an ex-Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  Although this is not the 24 hours, the caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL — December 1, 1974: Maurice “Mo” Carter driving a Chevrolet Camaro (No. 88) leads a Chevrolet Corvette during an IMSA GT race at Daytona International Speedway. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/december-1-1974-maurice-mo-carter-driving-a-chevrolet-news-photo/139063220

This looks to be the same car as in my second post.
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2013, 06:54:12 PM »

Is this an ex-Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL — February 4, 1973: Action during the 24 Hours of Daytona at Daytona International Speedway. The eventual race winning Brumos Porsche Carrera RSR 911 of Peter Gregg and Hurley Haywood (No. 59) leads the Porsche 908 of Paul Blancpain, Reinhold Joest and Mario Casoni (No. 57) and the Chevrolet Camaro of Richie Panch, Wilber Pickett and Ray Kessler (No. 9). (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info and a larger version of the picture can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/february-4-1973-action-during-the-24-hours-of-daytona-at-news-photo/152421365
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2013, 06:57:04 PM »

Is this an ex-Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL — February 4, 1973: Guido Levetto, Mario Levetto and Ara Dube drove this Chevrolet Camaro Z-28 to a 13th place finish in the 24 Hours of Daytona at Daytona International Speedway. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info and a larger version of the picture can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/february-4-1973-guido-levetto-mario-levetto-and-ara-dube-news-photo/145718862
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2013, 07:01:06 PM »

Is this an ex-Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  Although it doesn't identify the Camaro, the caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL — February 3-4, 1973: Reine Wisell, Jean-Louis Lafosse and Hughes de Fierlant drove this Lola Ford-Cosworth T282 to a 26th place finish in the 24 Hours of Daytona at Daytona International Speedway. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/february-3-4-1973-reine-wisell-jean-louis-lafosse-and-news-photo/135199726
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2013, 07:08:29 PM »

Is this an ex-Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL - FEBRUARY 6, 1972: The Chevrolet Corvette of Michael Oleyar and Robert Luebbe leads a Chevrolet Camaro during the 24 Hours of Daytona at Daytona International Speedway. (ISC Archives Photo via Getty Images)."  More info can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/the-chevrolet-corvette-of-michael-oleyar-and-robert-luebbe-news-photo/132706753
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2013, 07:19:28 PM »

Is this an ex-Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL — January 31 - February 1, 1970: The winning Porsche 917K of Pedro Rodriguez, Leo Kinnunen and Brian Redman (No. 2) gets set to put a lap on the Chevrolet Camaro driven by Larry Bock and Larry Dent (No. 11) during the 24 Hours of Daytona at Daytona International Speedway. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info can be seen here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/the-winning-porsche-917k-of-pedro-rodriguez-leo-kinnunen-news-photo/135199696
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2013, 07:32:31 PM »

I know this isn't the 24 hours but it is a Paul Revere 250 race at Daytona.  Is this the gold and black Yunick Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "Bobby Unser (left) prepares to climb into Henry 'Smokey' Yunick's (R) 1969 Z-28 Camaro for the start of the Paul Revere 250 on the road course of Daytona International Speedway in Daytona Beach, Florida on July 3 and 4, 1969. Wearing his trademark black cowboy hat, Yunick's legendary mechanical skills propelled drivers such as Unser, Johnny Rutherford, Glenn 'Fireball' Roberts, Curtis Turner, Bobby Johns, Paul Goldsmith and many others to racing success. (Photo by ISC Archives via Getty Images)"  This isn't a 1969 Z28 as the caption says.  More info can be found here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/indy-500-winner-and-sometimes-stock-car-driver-bobby-unser-news-photo/78306525
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2013, 07:45:37 PM »

I know this isn't the 24 hours but it is a Paul Revere 250 race at Daytona.  Is this the gold and black Yunick Trans Am Camaro?  I found this picture at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL - JULY 1968: Bobby Unser poses with Smokey YunickÕs Chevrolet Camaro that he drove in the Paul Revere 250 at Daytona International Speedway. The car caught fire during the race and Unser was relegated to a 22nd-place finish. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)"  More info can be seen here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/bobby-unser-poses-with-smokey-yunick%c3%b5s-chevrolet-camaro-news-photo/106763144

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SMKZ28
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« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2013, 08:01:37 PM »

Here is the Yunick car at the 1968 Daytona 24 hours.  I found it at Getty Images.  The caption states, "DAYTONA BEACH, FL — February 1968: Car owner Henry “Smokey” Yunick brought this 1968 Camaro to Daytona International Speedway for the 24 Hours of Daytona and hired superstars Bruce McLaren and Jim Hall to do the driving. The car did not run in the race, as inspectors came up with a list of 27 “infractions,” including an acid-dipped body and Lexan windows, and the car was ultimately disqualified from competition. (Photo by ISC Images & Archives via Getty Images)."  More info can be seen here: http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/february-1968-car-owner-henry-smokey-yunick-brought-this-news-photo/150003617
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« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2013, 11:02:07 PM »

The Carter camaro would be one of the ex Jim Hall 1970 T/A camaros which Mo purchased to run in the 71 and 72 seasons - was upgraded with big block engine etc for 73.  He ran  both IMSA and T/A.  My understanding is the car was wrecked in a
Mosport testing accident and parted out maybe in 76/77.  He then commissioned Brad Francis to build an IMSA  AAGT class tube frame camaro to race.

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SMKZ28
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« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2013, 04:32:32 PM »

The Carter camaro would be one of the ex Jim Hall 1970 T/A camaros which Mo purchased to run in the 71 and 72 seasons - was upgraded with big block engine etc for 73.  He ran  both IMSA and T/A.  My understanding is the car was wrecked in a
Mosport testing accident and parted out maybe in 76/77.  He then commissioned Brad Francis to build an IMSA  AAGT class tube frame camaro to race.



Thanks for the great info.  Too bad it didn't survive.  Could this be the same car or is this the tube frame car?  Either way it's interesting to note that it has the early 2nd Generation Camaro front end on it.  The pictures were taken by R. Allen Olmstead at the 1977 Watkins Glen 6 hour race.  I found them here: http://www.botchagaloop.net/
« Last Edit: January 14, 2013, 04:58:57 PM by SMKZ28 » Logged
Jon Mello
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« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2013, 06:16:27 PM »

That white and orange Camaro #56 is driven by Craig Carter, not Mo Carter. I think it may be owned currently by John Hildebrand and it is currently dark blue with yellow lettering.

The white #11 '69 Camaro at Daytona in 1970 looks to be the Larry Bock/Larry Drover car raced in Trans-Am that year.

The white with red sided Camaro following the red, white & blue Corvette appears to be the John Elliott car raced in Trans-Am
with sponsorship from Preston Hood Chevrolet in Fort Walton Beach, FL.
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Jon Mello
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« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2013, 06:54:46 PM »

Hey, finding a bunch of old photos is the easy part.  Trying to track down car numbers, figuring out which event, which driver and tracing the history takes talent and lots of time. Try it some time.
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« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2013, 08:45:20 PM »

from what robert says, the ex chaparral mo carter camaro was parted out. is the car that runs now as a chaparral camaro in historic trans-am the former sid rust car ? am I correct in assuming that agor car now also vintage raced, is the third ex chaparral car,now orange and running #13 ?  any body give some input ?

  mike
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« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2013, 08:54:06 PM »

Hey, finding a bunch of old photos is the easy part.  Trying to track down car numbers, figuring out which event, which driver and tracing the history takes talent and lots of time. Try it some time.


Brutally honest, but right on.
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cuda48
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« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2013, 09:11:56 PM »

Group 7,
I believe you are correct on both remaining Hall Camaros

Mike
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2013, 12:28:24 AM »

That white and orange Camaro #56 is driven by Craig Carter, not Mo Carter. I think it may be owned currently by John Hildebrand and it is currently dark blue with yellow lettering.

The white #11 '69 Camaro at Daytona in 1970 looks to be the Larry Bock/Larry Drover car raced in Trans-Am that year.

The white with red sided Camaro following the red, white & blue Corvette appears to be the John Elliott car raced in Trans-Am
with sponsorship from Preston Hood Chevrolet in Fort Walton Beach, FL.

Thanks for the info Jon.  I noticed the "Craig Carter" on the door after I posted the pic but you beat me to the punch.
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S A Dunbar
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« Reply #20 on: January 15, 2013, 10:25:55 AM »

from what robert says, the ex chaparral mo carter camaro was parted out. is the car that runs now as a chaparral camaro in historic trans-am the former sid rust car ? am I correct in assuming that agor car now also vintage raced, is the third ex chaparral car,now orange and running #13 ?  any body give some input ?

  mike

If it's the former Sid Rust Chaparral, then it's also the former Marshall Robbins Trans Am Camaro...  Same car...
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Jon Mello
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« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2013, 11:38:01 AM »

I was thinking Mark Waco got one of Jim Hall's Chaparral Camaros. Am I wrong about that?
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Jon Mello
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« Reply #22 on: January 15, 2013, 11:45:09 AM »

David Tom (Historic Trans-Am Registry) raced one of the Chapparal camaros in vintage several years ago.  He would probably know the story about these cars.

Robert Barg

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SMKZ28
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« Reply #23 on: January 15, 2013, 04:08:44 PM »

Hey, finding a bunch of old photos is the easy part.  Trying to track down car numbers, figuring out which event, which driver and tracing the history takes talent and lots of time. Try it some time.


Cuda48,
Why so negative.  What the hell did I do to you.  I have the searching talent.  I am an archivist/historian.  I know how to research.  I do things like this all the time.  I was searching for info on another subject when I came across these images and thought that people might be interested in them here.  I don't have all the answers and I'm sure you don't either.  Bringing things up and asking questions of others is how information is shared.  If this is the way I'm going to be treated then I'll think twice the next time I come across something relevent, or maybe I should check with you first to see if its ok to post something.  I don't need to deal with this kind of treatment for just trying to participate in this forum. 
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« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2013, 09:00:03 AM »

smkz28

thanks for those shots of camaros at daytona. didn't mean to sidetrack the thread into chaparral camaros, but there is a link to "mo" carter.  the chaparral team is my passion. post #11 of the yunick camaro is interesting in that in the top left corner you can just see jim hall. one doesn't see too many pictures of this car at daytona & sebring. I read somewhere that hall did do a couple of laps in the car.

mike
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« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2013, 09:31:38 AM »

SMK..  you can satisfy some of the people.. some of the time..  but it's impossible to satisfy everyone all the time.  Personally, I enjoy seeing the photos even if I don't know the driver/race/etc..  Smiley
Gary
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2013, 09:55:36 AM »

SMK..  you can satisfy some of the people.. some of the time..  but it's impossible to satisfy everyone all the time.  Personally, I enjoy seeing the photos even if I don't know the driver/race/etc..  Smiley
Gary

Thanks Gary, that's the feeling I've gotten from 99% of the responders to my other posts/threads.  Even though I was pissed yesterday when I posted my response, I'm not going to let one bad apple spoil the bunch so to speak.  If the attitude that was expressed to me earlier in this thread was shared by everyone then not a single bit of new information would have ever been posted on this website.  One person would have to do all the research on a particular subject and no one else would be able to comment on that subject because they would not have the knowledge on that subject since they didn't do the work.  I find that to be such a stupid notion on a web site that prides itself on finding and sharing new information.  I'm glad to see that not everyone feels that way. 

Scott
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SMKZ28
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« Reply #27 on: January 16, 2013, 09:56:46 AM »

smkz28

thanks for those shots of camaros at daytona. didn't mean to sidetrack the thread into chaparral camaros, but there is a link to "mo" carter.  the chaparral team is my passion. post #11 of the yunick camaro is interesting in that in the top left corner you can just see jim hall. one doesn't see too many pictures of this car at daytona & sebring. I read somewhere that hall did do a couple of laps in the car.

mike


No problem Mike.  I love the Chaparral Camaro but I also love the other cars Hall built.  Several years ago Jim Hall and his cars were the featured guest/marque at the vintage races up at Road America, Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin.  A few of his sports racers and can am cars did a few flying laps around the track by themselves.  I think this was one of the first times in years that they had been taken out of his museum and driven.  It was retty cool!

As for the Yunick Camaro pictures, this is why I posted this stuff.  I don't remember ever seeing these pictures either and thought others would be interested.  I believe you are correct that he did do a few laps in the car to test before it was denied by the race officials.  I'll look for the thread that deals with this car and add these pics there.

I'll check out the Mo Carter thread for more info on that car.

Scott
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« Reply #28 on: January 17, 2013, 11:03:35 AM »

from what robert says, the ex chaparral mo carter camaro was parted out. is the car that runs now as a chaparral camaro in historic trans-am the former sid rust car ? am I correct in assuming that agor car now also vintage raced, is the third ex chaparral car,now orange and running #13 ?  any body give some input ?

  mike

If it's the former Sid Rust Chaparral, then it's also the former Marshall Robbins Trans Am Camaro...  Same car...

Sid Rust at the 1974 SCCA Runoffs in his ex Chaparral/ex Marshall Robbins Camaro...
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« Reply #29 on: January 17, 2013, 08:19:56 PM »

s a dunbar
   wow ! thanks for that shot of sid rust in the ex chaparral camaro. it's the best one i've seen so far, other than some distant shots of the field at the runoffs in 1974.

  mike
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Jon Mello
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« Reply #30 on: January 17, 2013, 11:46:00 PM »

My understanding is that the Marshall Robbins car was a third "back-up" car that was not completed by Jim Hall. Robbins bought it and completed it to run the '71 season. Warren Agor got that car from Robbins to run the 1972 and later Trans-Ams. I don't know whose car Mo Carter got but I suspect it was the Ed Leslie car. Mark Waco got the other Jim Hall team car (descibed as ex-Hall in the 1971 Donnybrooke T/A article in Competition Press & Autoweek) and Waco ran it as car #1. I think Sid Rust must have gotten his car from Mark Waco.
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« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2013, 02:49:05 PM »

On the Historic Trans-Am website, the Marshall Robbins/Warren Agor car is described as the third Chaparral team car. Apparently the car was completed but was "severely damaged" during testing at Laguna Seca. That particular chassis did not compete in an actual Trans-Am race during the 1970 season, according to the HTA write-up.
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Jon Mello
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« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2013, 08:59:35 PM »

jon, thanks for that info on the chaparral camaros. I had seen that photo of waco doing some forest clearing at elkhart 1971, but didn't twig to it being the one of the hall cars.

  mike
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Jon Mello
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« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2013, 07:47:07 PM »

You're welcome, Mike. I guess I assumed you would have already known that.
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