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Author Topic: 1969 survivor Z on ebay  (Read 3785 times)
lcmc
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« on: September 25, 2012, 03:17:08 PM »

Anybody else watching this?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/69-RS-Z-28-survivor-11-388-miles-Try-finding-another-like-it-1972-/110956510111?forcev4exp=true
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Danny
1969 Z/28 X77
1970 Nova L78 9300 original miles
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« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2012, 03:52:17 PM »

Wow.. I am watching it now... I love it, but I'm prejudiced..    Smiley
It is optioned identical to my car except for my orange houndstooth.   
I have NO idea how this car has remained so clean... unless it's been in a sealed bag for 30 yrs.    Mine has 70K miles (all in the first 10 yrs) and has sat in my garage since 1980.. and mine is not nearly as clean as that one (although I'm cleaning mine now).   
Does anyone know where this owner lives?

Gary 
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
lcmc
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« Reply #2 on: September 25, 2012, 04:00:08 PM »

Looks to me like the engine has been repainted. Plus sway bar bushings replaced.
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Danny
1969 Z/28 X77
1970 Nova L78 9300 original miles
dannystarr
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« Reply #3 on: September 25, 2012, 05:30:20 PM »

Very nice car. But I agree on the sway bar bushings. I have never seen any brightly colored facory bushings. Also looks like the wrong dip stick  Huh.... Danny
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paceme
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« Reply #4 on: September 25, 2012, 10:23:19 PM »

Wow.. I am watching it now... I love it, but I'm prejudiced..    Smiley
It is optioned identical to my car except for my orange houndstooth.   
I have NO idea how this car has remained so clean... unless it's been in a sealed bag for 30 yrs.    Mine has 70K miles (all in the first 10 yrs) and has sat in my garage since 1980.. and mine is not nearly as clean as that one (although I'm cleaning mine now).   
Does anyone know where this owner lives?

Gary 

Yes Gary, it looks like a twin to our cars. I bought mine in the mid 70's because there is nothing nastier looking than a rs/z, hugger orange, black vinyl top with black stripes. The car is in NY.
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Steve Shauger
Vintage Certification™ Program, Providing Recognition And Status To Unrestored Vehicles. Website www.vintagecertification.com
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« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2012, 08:55:42 AM »

Lcmc you need that so i can come look. Great car.
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1969 Z28, Burgandy, numbers matching, 12,900 miles
1967 Plymouth GTX Hemi, 4 speed, dana
1961 Chrysler 300G convertible
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« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2012, 12:12:29 PM »

Wow.. I am watching it now... I love it, but I'm prejudiced..    Smiley
It is optioned identical to my car except for my orange houndstooth.   
I have NO idea how this car has remained so clean... unless it's been in a sealed bag for 30 yrs.    Mine has 70K miles (all in the first 10 yrs) and has sat in my garage since 1980.. and mine is not nearly as clean as that one (although I'm cleaning mine now).   
Does anyone know where this owner lives?

Gary 

Yes Gary, it looks like a twin to our cars. I bought mine in the mid 70's because there is nothing nastier looking than a rs/z, hugger orange, black vinyl top with black stripes. The car is in NY.

I'd love to see some photos of your car, Steve..    Mine is partially disassembled now for cleaning up, preserving and getting it back on the road (after 32+ yrs of 'resting' in my garage.. Smiley    I want to keep it 'original unrestored' as much as possible, but there are some things you just need to replace (like lower ball joints after 70K miles; the uppers are very tight, but I damaged the boot disassembling with my pickle fork).  Other rubber parts needs replacing like A-arm bushings, etc.     (I DO want to drive it again; it's been too long).l Smiley
PS.  I cleaned up the bottomside of the floor (lying on my back under the elevated car), and it looks great now; almost worth the pain it caused on my old body).. Smiley

Gary
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
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« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2012, 02:01:33 PM »

I noticed the sway bar bushings, maybe they just dried out? seems like pretty low milage to necessitate replacement though. I also noticed the dip stick  and motor re-sprayed. It looks to me like it has chrome exhaust tips, and I didn't think those would have been available with the chambered exhaust, is that right? Also is looks like it has a short spoiler on it, seems like a 02D car would have had a full length spoiler by then. One other thing which I am unsure about, does anybody else out there have this much overspray on there car? I know anything could have taken place back then, but that seems like a ton of overspray. My car is pretty original and I don't have anywhere near that much overspray
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1969 garnet red Z/28 46k mile unrestored X77
Looking for 3192477 (front) spiral shocks 3192851 (rear) please
Looking for an original LOF soft ray windshield
Looking for original Delco side post negative battery cable part # 6297651AV
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« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2012, 03:36:15 PM »

LH smog tube replacement?

Jimmy V.
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Jimmy V.
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« Reply #9 on: September 26, 2012, 04:52:27 PM »

My car is a month later and has at least that much over spray under the passenger side, which is the heavier side on the Ebay car.  Mine is pretty covered on that side.  Would love to see it in person. It sure has alot of gloss. I think engine is too shiney too. Wondered if the shocks are touched up, i didn't see any chips. Some people have different opinions on survivor.
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1969 Z28, Burgandy, numbers matching, 12,900 miles
1967 Plymouth GTX Hemi, 4 speed, dana
1961 Chrysler 300G convertible
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« Reply #10 on: September 26, 2012, 06:24:10 PM »

I noticed the sway bar bushings, maybe they just dried out? seems like pretty low milage to necessitate replacement though. I also noticed the dip stick  and motor re-sprayed. It looks to me like it has chrome exhaust tips, and I didn't think those would have been available with the chambered exhaust, is that right? Also is looks like it has a short spoiler on it, seems like a 02D car would have had a full length spoiler by then. One other thing which I am unsure about, does anybody else out there have this much overspray on there car? I know anything could have taken place back then, but that seems like a ton of overspray. My car is pretty original and I don't have anywhere near that much overspray

I have seen short spoilers on cars as late as 3B. The sway bushing were replaced with urethane for probably handling improvement. The exhaust is obviously a reproduction  chambered and the engine was removed, repainted with some reproduction replacement parts such as hoses. Floors look great, and I wouldn't be concerned as long as the overspray is not on components where it shouldn't be. What is anmazing is the shot of the front suspension; caliper, backing plate, inspection marks, finish on the caliper bracket, sticker on backing plate. That area is very well preserved and very rare to find in that condition.
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Steve Shauger
Vintage Certification™ Program, Providing Recognition And Status To Unrestored Vehicles. Website www.vintagecertification.com
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« Reply #11 on: September 26, 2012, 10:50:31 PM »

Steve:  I totally agree.   The floor looked remarkably like mine *(re the overspray)*, although that one is even nicer.
Bullitt:   43 yrs of *aging* does things to rubber even when sitting in a conditioned garage!
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
hgger69
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« Reply #12 on: September 27, 2012, 02:47:09 AM »

... Also is looks like it has a short spoiler on it, seems like a 02D car would have had a full length spoiler by then.

From CRG Visual ID 1969:
16.Spoilers were optional on Z28's up to approximately April 69. They were then included in the Z28 package. Narrower 1968 rear spoilers were used until Jan - March 1969.

I also have an 02D car with short spoiler, probably not factory mount, but as I understand it´s correct!
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Regards

Hakan from Sweden
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 355, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built
www.hakansmotorsida.com
IZRSSS
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« Reply #13 on: September 27, 2012, 07:15:37 AM »

I also have an 02D car with short spoiler, probably not factory mount, but as I understand it´s correct!

If one of your cars torsion rods is larger, chances are good its factory (installed to compensate for the added weight). If not, then your spoiler could have been installed by the dealership.
 
Another cross check and perhaps the most reliable would be a hole in your cars main frame for the center brace of the front spoiler/panel extension (AIM; D80-A1). If this hole is present, it is definately a factory D80 car.
 
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JohnZ
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« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2012, 12:55:27 PM »

My original 02D Norwood car has the short factory spoiler; it was shipped on February 28th.
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KurtS
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« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2012, 04:20:48 PM »

The car is a mixed bag. The paint looks good, but the rear shocks, exhaust, front suspension, engine, etc show signs of repainting/fluffing.
The disc bracket is still dichromated that bright??
NOR 265232
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Kurt S
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lcmc
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« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2012, 05:22:38 PM »

IMO the detailing he's done to the car devalue it. Engine repaint and so on should not have been done. It would be worth more left untouched. Now like Kurt says it's a mixed bag. If he wants to sell it he better let it go for the almost 80K it's at. It's at all the money.
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Danny
1969 Z/28 X77
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« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2012, 07:04:46 PM »

IMO the detailing he's done to the car devalue it. Engine repaint and so on should not have been done. It would be worth more left untouched. Now like Kurt says it's a mixed bag. If he wants to sell it he better let it go for the almost 80K it's at. It's at all the money.
After 43 yrs, it's normal that it had some maintenance, even with the relatively low mileage; the urethane swaybar bushings indicate that he DID drive it a little, even if not many miles.   Whenever I have to remove a part on my car(s) for maintenance, I always clean and if necessary do whatever is required to *preserve* it (ie. eliminate rust, etc).   so I don't see a big problem with the man's car; it's the NICEST one I've seen in the past 30 yrs (including all the overrestored, plastic painted restorations).
Oh..  and it bid to nearly $87K... and he didn't sell it.   Actually, I considered that a good value for the car as well...  assuming that all the numbers on the car are correct (which I didn't see in the ebay info)..

Re some of the other comments:   My disk brake brackets look very similar to his after cleaning).. and I've still got paint marking residue on the spindles, and my car had 70K+ miles on it by 1980 when I parked it (also in a conditioned garage).   His floorboard looks very similar to mine (after I've cleaned mine).

PS.  I'd rather have that car (or mine) than any restored Z28 I've seen (and yes, I've attended national and regional shows for 30 yrs or more).

Gary
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
lcmc
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« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2012, 07:30:43 PM »

IMO the detailing he's done to the car devalue it. Engine repaint and so on should not have been done. It would be worth more left untouched. Now like Kurt says it's a mixed bag. If he wants to sell it he better let it go for the almost 80K it's at. It's at all the money.
After 43 yrs, it's normal that it had some maintenance, even with the relatively low mileage; the urethane swaybar bushings indicate that he DID drive it a little, even if not many miles.   Whenever I have to remove a part on my car(s) for maintenance, I always clean and if necessary do whatever is required to *preserve* it (ie. eliminate rust, etc).   so I don't see a big problem with the man's car; it's the NICEST one I've seen in the past 30 yrs (including all the overrestored, plastic painted restorations).
Oh..  and it bid to nearly $87K... and he didn't sell it.   Actually, I considered that a good value for the car as well...  assuming that all the numbers on the car are correct (which I didn't see in the ebay info)..

Re some of the other comments:   My disk brake brackets look very similar to his after cleaning).. and I've still got paint marking residue on the spindles, and my car had 70K+ miles on it by 1980 when I parked it (also in a conditioned garage).   His floorboard looks very similar to mine (after I've cleaned mine).

PS.  I'd rather have that car (or mine) than any restored Z28 I've seen (and yes, I've attended national and regional shows for 30 yrs or more).

Gary

My point is the repaint of engine should not have been done. Cleaning and replacing parts that need it doesn't bother me however on that car I would have used NOS parts. I agree I'd rather have that car than a restored car.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2012, 08:08:35 PM by lcmc » Logged

Danny
1969 Z/28 X77
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« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2012, 10:56:53 AM »

I guess I have a problem with performing maintenance on a part of my car, and finding bare metail (beginning to corrode) that was originally *(poorly) painted, and NOT wanting to protect and preserve the metail.   Tje paint that I put on is not original, but when the *original coating/paint* is all gone... do you leave it dirty/rusting/bare?  or do you clean, derust, and preserve?   Maybe some discussion on this issue will help a lot of us with original cars...?

Gary
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
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« Reply #20 on: October 07, 2012, 11:40:56 AM »

 Well, I'll tell you what I am in the position of. I have a survivor 67 L35 I bought in 1980..original paint, original motor and drive train, spark plug wires dated 1972 (real, not repos), original glass, etc....

Just to name a few areas needing attention:

The windshield lamination has separated a lot around the edges
The trunk, header and roof top paint (all horizontal surfaces actually) has dried a lot, spider crazed, faded and some minor oxidation has started. No buffing will take this out.
A few very minor door dings that stand out being the car is a dark color.
Chassis surface oxidation in several areas
Rims need a repaint
Battery tray that is beyond rotted
Dinged and pitted fender well and RS rocker trims

   I have to draw a line somewhere when to stop worrying about being original once and restoring the whole car otherwise one can be displaying an original 'sh*tty' looking car. Sure, many like to see original paint, etc but for a very well preserved car, that is easy to do. But, like being original only once, I'm living a life only once so I want to do what I want to do and not necessarily what others say I should do. Looking at resale prices, I don't see enough true survivors to say that they really command the higher resale price. As with anything, a price of worth is what someone will pay for it and from what I have seen thus far people will pay good money for a well restored car vs. an original that is not at the same "pretty" level. I don't sell my cars anyhow but do want to drive them before passing them on to my kids.
  This is just me and my opinion and I have struggled a lot with the decision of "to restore, or not to restore" but each time I look at the dead paint and oxidation that is starting, I don't want to let rust take over for the sake of being original.

Mike
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67 LOS SS/RS L35 Hardtop - Original w/UOIT
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« Reply #21 on: October 07, 2012, 11:53:17 AM »

In your case Mike, I'd suggest you show it a few times (preferable at a national show so knowledgeable people get opportunity to see another original car)..   document it as well as possible with photos, etc..  and THEN build it so you LIKE it.. and enjoy it...   Smiley
...  as an old corvette buddy of mine (who is now gone) once said..  'This is not a dress rehearsal; we only LIVE once... "
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Gary W.  /  69Z28-RS, 72 B 720 cowl console rosewood all tint
69 Corvette convertible, silver/black 350 hp,
60 Corvette white/red, 72 Corvette coupe (2), 
90 ZR1 red/red #246, 90 ZR1 white/gray #2466
72 El Camino, '55 Nomad, '57 Nomad, '57 B/A Sedan
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« Reply #22 on: October 07, 2012, 12:06:09 PM »

IMO, it seems like there are enough restored cars out there to go ahead and look for one that is already done. I can understand if a car just falls into your lap, you can't help but buy it, if its that great of a deal. It just seems like there are guys out there looking specifically for a unrestored cars, and this is shaping up more and more to be a niche market. Unless you over paid for a unrestored that was in shi**y condition, I would be surprised if you lost money when selling one. The Camaro/Car guy in me says leave it alone as much as you can and preserve the car in its original condition or sell it to someone seeking that condition, but in the end if taking the journey once again to see a car restored is what gets your rocks off, than its your car to do so.
I would somewhat agree with Gary (69Z28-RS) in response to paint condition or rusty areas, although Bills recent purchase of a low milage but poorly stored Z(burgandy) is on the borderline of where I would think you have to delve into certain areas just make sure it doesn't get worse.
 Have a good one!
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1969 garnet red Z/28 46k mile unrestored X77
Looking for 3192477 (front) spiral shocks 3192851 (rear) please
Looking for an original LOF soft ray windshield
Looking for original Delco side post negative battery cable part # 6297651AV
BillOhio
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« Reply #23 on: October 07, 2012, 06:54:58 PM »

Today pulled the subframe out from under my car. Glad I did. After getting the fenders off, it really needed attention behind them at the base of the firewall and under the door hinges. It would have been going down hill to have gotten it damp in these areas. The car has come apart nice except some of the bolts where the wheel well mouldings where bolted to the inner and outer fenders. There are places on the car that are as perfect as you could want, like the bottom of the firewall into the tunnel, looks like new. I have pictures I should post but will need to put them in my computer and downsize enough. 
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1969 Z28, Burgandy, numbers matching, 12,900 miles
1967 Plymouth GTX Hemi, 4 speed, dana
1961 Chrysler 300G convertible
68camaroz28
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« Reply #24 on: October 07, 2012, 07:36:36 PM »

Today pulled the subframe out from under my car. Glad I did. After getting the fenders off, it really needed attention behind them at the base of the firewall and under the door hinges. It would have been going down hill to have gotten it damp in these areas. The car has come apart nice except some of the bolts where the wheel well mouldings where bolted to the inner and outer fenders. There are places on the car that are as perfect as you could want, like the bottom of the firewall into the tunnel, looks like new. I have pictures I should post but will need to put them in my computer and downsize enough. 

Start a build thread on team camaro. Helps keep us focused..... Smiley
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Chick
68 Z/28 NOR 01B Orig motor/trans/rear
69 Z/28 NOR 07A Orig Block & GM Cross-ram/carbs
69 L34 Rest. Nova Father/Son Car
69 L78 Surv Nova Purch 4/69 31K miles
67 L89 Corv Tribute
68 Corv 427/400 Orig motor
07 Corv Z06
R 68Z build- http://www.camaros.net/forums/showthread.php?t=182584
hgger69
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« Reply #25 on: October 08, 2012, 02:42:31 AM »

My original 02D Norwood car has the short factory spoiler; it was shipped on February 28th.
Just realized it now that maybee our cars where next to each other during production John! Wink
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Regards

Hakan from Sweden
1969 Camaro X44, hugger orange, 355, TH350, 4:10 12 bolt Posi, RPO Z87, black/white houndstooth, 14" steel wheels & dog dish, 02D built
www.hakansmotorsida.com
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