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97256 Posts in 11694 Topics by 4578 Members
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886  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Decoding/Numbers / Re: "ML" Engine Stamp.. on: February 19, 2012, 10:29:45 AM
Matching numbers means THE engine the car came with from the factory.
I tend to agree but I think this "numbers matching" word is a paradox in the car collecting arena.

  This reminds me of former president Clinton's famous quotes:
"I didn't inhale"
When asked about a sexual relation with Monica "It depends upon of what the meaning of the word... is..is"

  I do remember reading somewhere a case where a buyer bought a "numbers matching car" and later found it was a restamp and took the seller to court. The seller was not found guilty because numbers matching didn't mean original. So "numbers matching" is a play of words, IMO.   Undecided

  After getting back into this hobby late last year I have done a lot of reading catch ups and the topic of restamps caught my attention and the seemingly wide spread use of it because of that human addiction called greed. But I can't help ponder, what is accepted and what is not, has come down to a pick and choose acceptance in his hobby. I mean, you can now get date coded glass and tell a potential buyer it's original glass. Nobody gets uptight when someone says I got dated glass, hose clamps, wires, etc...  but a VIN or other date codes (alternators and distributors), then the conversations gets explosive. What is the real case here...the act of restamps or the potential value that can be obtained from a restamp that causes a pick and choose practice?  Huh
  In the case of this so called Yenko, it's out right fraud. But this hobby needs to get a clear legal definition of what a 'numbers matching' car is so the word game semantics can stop and potential buyers and sellers know what is legally correct in definition and what is not.

Just my 2 cents
Mike
887  Camaro Research Group Discussion / General Discussion / Re: Bucket Seat Back teather cable on: February 18, 2012, 05:14:16 PM
In post #76 I said my NOR was gray with gray ends, but looking at the picture Boston14 posted, that is more of what I have. It looks more like an off white (towards gray) to me.
So it looks like we are back to either "white" or black cables with either gray or black heat shrink ends.

Mike
888  Camaro Research Group Discussion / General Discussion / Re: REAL nice Gold Z/28 on eBay, Cowl Tag Correct? on: February 18, 2012, 10:05:10 AM
 Seems like a lot of work went into this restoration. I like the attention to paint marks and other finer details.
But I'm curious why the oil pan bolts aren't painted if they went that far in details and why the grade 8 rear differential cover are needed.
For a Jan 69 born date, the bell housing looks to have a casting date the 4th week of April. Likely 1968? Seems way too soon for a Jan 69.
 I'm just nit picking. Anyhow it looks like this was shredded in previous posts here a while back.
Pretty car though.

Mike
889  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 67 BB vacuum advance hose stripe color? on: February 18, 2012, 09:33:17 AM
  Now that's a very likely answer.   
  Looking at both hoses now I see the smog valve hose has no color stripe and doesn't have those characteristic ribs. I'd guess that somewhere in the cars first 13 years (the last 6 of that 13 spent under beach chairs in a garage before it was sold) the smog valve hose was replaced and maybe used a section of that to replace the vacuum hose. I can certainly accept that reasoning.

Thanks!
Mike
890  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 67 Battery cables 67 V8 with AC on: February 17, 2012, 09:30:36 PM
 I double checked and at first it looked like a Y but after gently rubbing a smudge near it, the X appeared.
Definitely  XP

Mike
891  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Decoding/Numbers / Re: "ML" Engine Stamp.. on: February 17, 2012, 05:02:19 PM
Hi Steve,

4. "M" font incorrect. Others too?

I'm not sure if the M is wrong though in the posted picture I agree it just doesn't look right.
I have seen 3 types of M fonts on BB pads. Some with the middle extended to the bottom and others 1/2 way down.
The 3rd is what visually looks like a an ever so slightly wider character width size for both type of M's.
My feeling is that the supplier of the font stamps may vary?

The 8 digit engine stamp is a dead give away.
Ask the seller to come to this group to try to justify the originality or the buyer to warn him/her.

My hats off to you for alerting the potential buyer of this fake!

Mike
892  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / 67 BB vacuum advance hose stripe color? on: February 17, 2012, 03:09:38 PM
 In looking to freshen up my 67 L35 engine compartment I cleaned some hoses including the vacuum advance hose with soap and water.
What I thought was a dirty white stripe is actually a red stripe. In the resto parts catalogs I see only a white stripe
being advertised as a correct replacement. I uploaded 2 images of the stripe and the opposite side with what looks like the correct hose rib lines.
Does anyone have an original hose to compare colors? This was on the car when I bought it 30+ years ago.

Thanks,
Mike
893  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Decoding/Numbers / Re: "ML" Engine Stamp.. on: February 17, 2012, 09:54:08 AM
This is fun in a way...  Cheesy
Here is another one when digging deeper...
The VIN range for this car is around August 1969 per CRG
The block assembly date of 0101 (what the heck is that number 7 doing here!?) is Jan 1969. IMO, way too early for any COPO car.

But hey....afterall it is a 'number matching' car!
Then again, I have 'matching' features of Tom Cruise...you have seen it before....2 eyes, 2 ears, 1 nose and mouth.  Grin

Mike
894  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Decoding/Numbers / Re: "ML" Engine Stamp.. on: February 17, 2012, 08:44:51 AM
 I'm not too up on 1969 Camaro's so I can't find 10 things  Grin  but what little I did find in the few minutes before heading to work are:
Block casting is a 427 ci. On CRG a 427 would be a COPO
The ML would indicate a COPO 9560 ZL1 aluminum engine vs. a COPO 9561 iron block. This block is iron
I'm guessing that the ZL-1 block should be 3946052?
The VIN does not appear on the CRG COPO listing
The engine code has a tilted numeric 1 (the second in the sequence)
The engine code is using numeric 1 in place of the letter I (but that may be OK if I and 1's are used interchangeably)
The engine code has 8 characters instead of the 7 I normally see on BB pads
Were ZL1 engines supposed to painted black?

That's all I can quickly come up with.
Gotta head to work!
Mike
895  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 67 Battery cables 67 V8 with AC on: February 16, 2012, 10:04:13 PM
Hi Bob,

Not sure if this helps, but I checked my 67 LOS w/L35 (no AC of course) that still has the original cables and the P/N are:
6289139 ZM for +
2987212 YP for -

Mike
896  Camaro Research Group Discussion / General Discussion / Re: Bucket Seat Back teather cable on: February 15, 2012, 06:53:28 PM
 I just checked both my '67 Camaros and found the following:
NOR 5B 760Z standard black interior (restored interior but used same cable) - gray cable coating and gray heat shrink ends
LOS 4B 760Z standard black interior (original survivor interior) - black cable coating and black heat shrink ends
Neither car has a cable on the drivers seat.
I think it may be safe to assume there were multiple colors.

Mike
897  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Maintenance / Re: "Hot Slot" equipped cast iron intake manifold modifications.. on: February 14, 2012, 02:20:06 PM
 I've read that the metal plate against the throttle base doesn't seal good in some situation when there is a slight warp in the baseplate.
I've been using the gasket-metal-gasket stack for years with success (along with plugged slot holes).
The extra ~.030" from the second gasket made no difference in the choke function at all.


Mike
898  Camaro Research Group Discussion / General Discussion / Re: 4K pics on: February 14, 2012, 02:13:31 PM
Hi Ed,

  The hyperlink to the steering wheel article is what I had read months ago. It sure puts to rest some doubts I have had about mine and also people telling me that I should have the SS cap when in fact I had the standard cap for the 30+ years I have owned both cars. The pin striping rolled into the RS package makes sense now (I wasn't aware of that fact). This is what I have on my cars.

Thanks,
Mike
899  Camaro Research Group Discussion / General Discussion / Re: 4K pics on: February 13, 2012, 09:59:29 PM
 Interesting...I wasn't aware there was a code on the cowl tag for pin striping  Huh . My 67 LOS car (4B) has the original paint and striping but I don't remember seeing any code for it. Unless maybe it's part of another option package?

Mike
900  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Decoding/Numbers / Re: L78 engine stamps on: February 13, 2012, 09:05:51 PM
  Just curious..... How is the car being advertised? Original motor or restored to original?

Mike
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