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111434 Posts in 12830 Topics by 4913 Members
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76  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: z28 with white stripes, cowl pics on early 69 cars on: June 21, 2013, 12:01:07 PM
Bill, a couple of photos of my 4C Nor car (original paint). Let me know if you need more detailed photos.

77  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 69 Z 302 pulley finishes on: June 21, 2013, 11:30:31 AM
Edmontonvillage - Thanks and interesting.  I'll have to inspect the pulley better and determine if it's paint.   Must be a very light paint as it's not obvious like the other components.

There is no indication it was dip painted (lacks tell tale runs) however its low gloss (at least 44 years later it is). I have not attempted to duplicate it.
78  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: Dusk Blue Z on ebay 06/20/13 on: June 21, 2013, 01:26:00 AM
There are SOOOO many things wrong.



1. Looks to have replacement stainless exhaust
2. Looks like it has an aftermarket Hurst shifter to me
3. Hurst emblem on the console??? Certainly not "stock".
4. GM sticker on the door jam
6. Repop NK1 steering wheel
7. As been observed already, missing smog
8. As been observed already, repop jack and hold down (the air cleaner stud looks to be just a bit too long too!)
8. "Triple Dusk Blue Z28/RS less the 1% had this color and options combination" - I have NO CLUE where he got this info from. Must have pulled it out of his @$$
9. "F41 suspension" - Sorry, NOT available on the Z28
10. "I have over $71,000 in NADA/McNeish Value at $75,000+" - Jerry didn't certify this car, so where did this number come from??

Many other things as well, but I don't have the time to post them all


A few more:
 - Spare tire drum painted gray rather than black
 - Hood hinges and springs appear to be painted.
 - Paint line dividing firewall from cowl is too defined, appears to have been masked (no white stripe overspray visible)
 - Trunk mat (not available without deluxe interior)
 - Phillips screw used to secure cowl relay to firewall. Unusually high mounting position on cowl seam.
 - RS hoses are mis-routed on firewall.
 - Left side shock mounting plate is incorrect.
 - Oversize screws securing console shifter plate.
 - Upper hood latch assembly appears to be painted silver or media blasted (could be from photo flash washout).
 - Lower hood latch assembly painted black.
 - Wood applique trim plates behind radio knobs missing.
 - Washer bottle cap is new/NOS replacement, hose incorrectly routed to pump.
 - Intake manifold front plug incorrect.
 - Both fender mounted hood bumpers missing.
 - Cowl to hood seal either missing or painted body color (poor image)
 - Battery cable grounded to upper alternator bracket.
 - Replacement or restoration voltage regulator.
 - Air cleaner assembly paint and all decals too fresh for 71,000 mile, 44 year old car.

79  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Fuel Line Frame Rail Bracket Bolt on: June 20, 2013, 01:44:28 AM
Up on the hoist

Removed the shortened fuel line and compared it with the replacement  (yes it had been cut short by that much...)

Removed the fuel line clips and bolts and realized I am missing a rear frame rail clip. Here are the bolt head markings from my 4C Nor car:

Installation complete (less 1 clip still to locate)

80  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Fuel Line Frame Rail Bracket Bolt on: June 18, 2013, 06:33:13 PM
Thanks to those CRG members who posted (especially with photos) in response to my question.  It is clear there were a few different fasteners used on the fuel line bracket. Your input was very helpful.
81  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Fuel Line Frame Rail Bracket Bolt on: June 17, 2013, 12:01:11 PM
That is not the normal bolt for that bracket on a NOR car

Although the donor fuel line is from a 2C Van Nuys built car, my car is a 4C Norwood build.  How does the Nor bolt differ?
82  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Fuel Line Frame Rail Bracket Bolt on: June 15, 2013, 08:58:34 PM
The bolt that holds the fuel line bracket near the tank on my car is a dark phosphate 5/16"-18 X 1.0" pointed bolt with a 3/4" conical washer attached.  The head marking is an Anchor over T.  AMK offers the same bolt, only 1/8 inch shorter, part # B-10900. Their price is $4.00 for 2.  Hope this helps.

Very helpful, thanks!
83  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / 1969 Fuel Line Frame Rail Bracket Bolt on: June 15, 2013, 11:03:50 AM
The fuel line on my '69 Z/28 was cut at some point likely to install an electric fuel pump. A very generous CRG member provided me a survivor fuel line from a 2C Van Nuys car with 52K miles that I plan to use as a replacement. I have an orginal fuel line clip that bolts to the frame rail beside the fuel tank (see photo) however I'm trying to confirm the correct attaching bolt details. I likely have one however I need to ensure its the correct one. If anyone has one handy I'd appreciate if you would post a photo and details regarding the size, head markings and washer configuration, thanks.      

84  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Endura VE3 Load Rest / Jack Hook - Original vs Reproduction on: June 01, 2013, 10:56:33 AM
Lloyd, in the pictures it appears that the 4 tabs on the mast bracket are slightly thicker on the repro part than on the original. Is that so, and (if correct) is the steel used throughout the repro version of a heavier gauge?

Tim, good observation, the steel used in the reproduction hook appears to be 10 gauge and the original uses 11 gauge.   



85  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Endura VE3 Load Rest / Jack Hook - Original vs Reproduction on: May 31, 2013, 12:29:27 PM
Lloyd, thank you for taking the time to do the write up - not hared to do, but it takes time.

Congrats on the have become a real master on locating these orig parts....

Can u help me find a AC convert fender baffle?

Eddie, coming from you that's is a high complement, very kind. It took me over a year to locate the hook and then I had to make my check book bleed to get it. A mixed blessing.
86  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Endura VE3 Load Rest / Jack Hook - Original vs Reproduction on: May 31, 2013, 12:26:19 PM
I'm surprised that any vendor spent the money to design and develop the dies to reproduce that hook, in view of the potentially VERY low demand for the part.

John, me too, however its a pretty nice part as compared to so many hastily produced, low fidelity reproduction parts in the market. 
87  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Endura VE3 Load Rest / Jack Hook - Original vs Reproduction on: May 31, 2013, 09:49:19 AM
"Good write-up Lloyd! Are you able to say where you got the original from? The few that I've seen for sale have been priced as though made of solid gold...."

I wish I could brag that I found the hook on a weekend swap meet archaeological dig however I didn't, I purchased it from a parts vendors.
88  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: 1969 Endura VE3 Load Rest / Jack Hook - Original vs Reproduction on: May 31, 2013, 09:35:02 AM
Great presentation. It's great to see these parts viewed in this manner so we can choose whether to look for original or buy reproductions site unseen. Unless you have an original part to compare with, it is often hard to comparison shop.

Gary, considering that the hook and jack assembly is stored under the spare tire and rarely sees the light of day, budget and personal preference dictate choices here. I have been painstakingly working through correcting many details on my car for the past couple of years and really wanted to continue in the theme of correct, original parts only.  
89  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / 1969 Endura VE3 Load Rest / Jack Hook - Original vs Reproduction on: May 30, 2013, 11:59:01 PM
When I purchased my 69 RS/Z28 with a factory installed Endura (VE3) bumper, as is often the case the jack and its related parts were missing. I located an original base, ratcheting mechanism, mast, J hook, wing nut and lug wrench with relative ease however was unable to locate an Endura jack hook.  I decided to purchase a reproduction from HBC and although its well made and a reasonable approximation of the original, it was just too fresh and shiny rather than "survivor original" in keeping with the rest of the car so after a considerable search I located the original hook pictured here. As the Endura VE3 jack hook is reasonably rare and not often photographed in captivity I thought I would post a few photos of the original and the reproduction as I have not seen a similar comparison posted anywhere else.  

Overall dimensions and weight are similar however there are several subtle differences:

The arch of the hook's backbone is more pronounced on the reproduction and the midsection of the arch is wider. Although it is difficult to see, and oxidation may play a part, the paint color on the original is a darker less intense shade of blue. The bottom and top ends of the original also have a finer taper. From this side angle the tabs on the back of the mask bracket are slightly bent upward on the original.

The hole located in the mid arch is positioned higher and the mast bracket is bent at a much steeper angle on the original hook.

This top down view of the back of the mast bracket shows a more defined die cut of the tabs and a straight cut and alignment vs slightly flared tab ends on the reproduction.

In this photo the difference in the angles of the mast brackets is quite noticeable. Also the die cut of the original braket is more defined or crisp vs the reproduction.

The stamping around the main rivet is more elongated on the original and the crush end of the rivet is domed in the center vs flat on the reproduction.

The font used for the "VE3" stamping is the same however is better defined and has better horizontal alignment on the original. The rivet is slightly larger and far more bulbous shaped on the reproduction hook.

The "CAMARO 1969 UN" stamping on the original uses a slightly larger point size and is shallower however the same font is used. Centering and horizontal alignment is better on the original. The edge radius of the stamping on the orignal is also wider. The rivet is painted on both and the original has a wider lip  

90  Camaro Research Group Discussion / Originality / Re: Cowl Hood Relay - Factory Original with Rivet? on: May 30, 2013, 10:15:04 PM
Here I have 2 cowl hood relays (PN 7729602), a used one that appeared in my original post and another which is NOS. The NOS relay is an earlier service replacement as indicated by the box design and shows minor design variations. It uses a open center rivet to attach one of the blades and the base design is also different, perhaps from a different supplier. A more noteable difference is on the front of the case. Both have a drop of solder (as suggested by Warren - WorkinProgress)  however the earlier NOS part also has a (hollow) brass fastener attached to the case where the solder pooled.   

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