F41 consisted of special front and rear springs and shocks.

Ed

[HORRIBLE]

Looks like there's a new player in the FAKE TRIM TAG/FAKE VIN TAG game. (Thanks to Warren Leunig for pointing them out)

deniser3592 from Uxbridge, Ontario Canada

Check out the feedback and you'll see the blank VIN tags. Also note the name "Bill" in THIS AUCTION. I wonder if it's our old friend Bill Clements. Last I heard he had moved to Canada, so it's very possible.

In this example, there are two:

1967 Trim Tag

01E E
ST 67 12437 NOR180567 BODY
TR 760-Z K-K PAINT
2HLG 3L

1969 Trim Tag

ST 69 12437 NOR193681 BDY
TR 719 52 52 PNT
12B X33 D80

Thank goodness they're HORRIBLE and a 5 year old could tell the difference!!

Ed

Is that Bill Clements?

It is. He's been making this crap since the early 70's. He started out making them for Tri-Five Chevy's (so guys could change interior and/or exterior colors) and branched out.

In my opinion, HE and HE ALONE is the main reason this "hobby" is so screwed up. Do a Google search on Bill Clements Chevycraft and you'll see what I mean. I know of NO ONE that has anything good to say about this guy.

Ed

[3]

Ed not sure if it was just a mistype but the cowl tag has a 12437..  Maybe Matt needs to post a pic of the vin tag.

Darrell, the trim tag has no bearing on which engine was installed in the car. It was used by Fisher Body to indicate what interior was to be installed. For 1967, 12337 on the VIN indicates an L6 engine and 12437 on the trim tag indicates standard interior. (12637 would be a Coupe with deluxe interior)

More info HERE.

Ed

Hi Matt. Again, welcome to the site. As I stated in your other thread, you have a 1967 6 cylinder coupe (as indicated in the VIN - 123377L126776) assembled in Van Nuys, CA. The build date of 12A indicates your cars assembly process was started the first week of December, 1966. The beginning of 1967 production was August, 1966, so your car is actually 4 months into the model year.

The information to decode your trim tag can be found HERE, but a real quick and dirty is it came with red exterior, red standard bucket seats and a tinted windshield.

Ed

Matt, welcome to the site. The numbers you posted are casting numbers and aren't really of any help. You need to see what the engine suffix code is to be able to tell if it's the original engine or not. You have a 6 cylinder car, so there won't be a partial VIN stamped on the pad, but look at THIS PICTURE and tell us what the suffix code is.

Ed

And here's page 3:

Ed

HELM, Inc was (and still is) the original publisher for service literature for GM (as well as other companies) cars and trucks. Shop manuals, owner's manuals, overhaul manuals, service manuals, etc...

Here's what the HELM pages (1 and 2) look like in the back of the 69 owners manual.

Ed

[54]

Victor, that part number (3928345) doesn't come up as anything. Are you sure you wrote it down correctly? If it's actually 3928354, it's the same as I posted above.

Ed

Yes, it's a repop. Anytime you see a trim tag from billc27806 you can pretty much guarantee it's a reproduction.

For future searches:

ST69 12437 NOR328288 BDY
TR 712 - - PNT
03D X33

Ed

That doesn't appear to have ever been black. December, 1967 is a bit early for the shroud without the black accent, but you never know. It may have been blue from the factory or the shroud (or the entire wheel) may have been replaced at some point in time. Or a prior owner may have removed the black (it's the color of the steering wheel under the black). Unfortunately, there's no way to tell unless you have a history of the car.

The February, 1968 date was based on cars we had in the database. Up to that time, the shrouds had the black accent. There was a small gap where both shrouds were seen, but it was early in February. After about the second week, there aren't any black shrouds, so that's when it appears the changover occured.

Ed

Yes, all cars have the rubber bumper even with J50. As for the pipe, the only real differences are the lengths and the bends. Post a picture of your pipe with a ruler and we can tell you which one you have.

Ed

[REAL]

I was on another site, and some thought if you don't have original paper work, original drive train, then it's a clone as far as they were concerned.

Paperwork (REAL paperwork) proves what you have. If you don't have paperwork, then you can't always prove what you have, but the car could still be what it's represented as.

For instance, for 1969, a real X33 trim tag (that's correctly dated for a particular cars VIN) proves the car's a real Z28. It may no longer have the original engine, transmission, axle, etc..., but that one item has just proven the car left the factory as a Z28.

Ed

[NEVER]

In the automotive world, the definition of a clone is to convert it into something it wasn't from the factory. With regards to the first generation Camaro, it's done mostly to change a non-Z28 into a Z28, a non-Yenko into a Yenko, a non-SS into an SS, a non-ZL1 into a ZL1, a non-Z11 inito a Z11, etc... And cloning mostly refers to the engine itself (ie, Z28) but not always (ie, Z11).

And you'll NEVER see the reverse, such as converting a real Z28 into a base model, or a real ZL1 converted into a 6 cylinder coupe!!

Ed

Yes, it's in the db. It was on ebay back in November of 2011 for 49k. At that time it had a 30 year old paint job. Not sure if it's been repainted since, but it looks very nice for 30 years old. The engine has been restored but the interior is original. That's about all we have in the db regarding the car but Kurt may have additional info.

Ed