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Messages - bertfam

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Originality / Re: AIR pump pulley PN# (for '68 396) ???
« on: May 11, 2006, 11:02:56 PM »
Well, okay... Then according to my September, 1968 P&A 34, the P/N's are as follows:

1968 Nova, Camaro (396) (exc. Sp. H/Per., C.A.C) - 3917234
1968 All (307, 327, 350), 1968 Nova, Chevelle, Camaro w/C.A.C. (8 cyl.) (exc. P.G), 1968 Chevelle (S.S.) w/C.A.C. - 3917238
1968 Nova, Chevelle, Camaro (exc A.T., C.A.C. 396), 1969 Nova (exc. P.G., 396), 1969 Camaro (exc. P.G., Sp. H/Per. 396) - 3927116
1968 All w/Sp. H/Per. (396) - 3925522

So according to the P&A, the 3917234 would be correct for the 396/325 and 396/350 (NON A/C) Camaro, with the 3917238 being used on the 396/325 and 396/350 (WITH A/C, but WITHOUT Powerglide). The problem is, I can't seem to find a pulley number for the 396/325 and 396/350 with A/C AND Powerglide!!!

Make things clear???!!!


Originality / Re: AIR pump pulley PN# (for '68 396) ???
« on: May 11, 2006, 09:57:16 PM »
Why not use the CRG 1968 Pulley Reference Chart??


General Discussion / Re: Trying to contact Jon Mello
« on: May 03, 2006, 01:59:36 AM »

Here's a link to Jon's WEB site. There's an "Email us" in the upper right corner.


Originality / Re: Caps for 69 (68?) RS windshield washer bracket
« on: May 01, 2006, 07:33:58 PM »

Thanks, that's what I figured since there's not one on the passengers side (spare tire in the way so it's not needed), but now the real question. WHY did the convertibles not come with this? We have luggage too!!!


Originality / Re: Caps for 69 (68?) RS windshield washer bracket
« on: May 01, 2006, 02:04:47 PM »
If you look in the AIM (UPC4, Sheet B3 for 1968), you'll see that there was a cap (P/N 3908372) installed on the left rear shock on all first gen's except convertibles. I'm not sure why it exists, nor do I know why it wasn't installed on convertibles. Perhaps for some kind of protections to keep things from getting ripped, but that's just a guess. JohnZ can probably tell us the REAL reason!


Decoding/Numbers / Re: 1967 Cowl Tag Date and Engine Build Date
« on: April 27, 2006, 04:35:00 PM »

Regarding your first question on how to tell a reproduction tag from a factory one, it's an unwritten rule on most forums that this information not be discussed for a fairly obvious reason. We don't want the people reproducing these things to get better at it!

As for your second question, you are quite correct. In the early 80's no one even knew what X codes were, or 4P 3L, etc... on Trim Tags. Therefore why go through the trouble of reproducing a tag to fake a car. However, tags were being reproduced for a competely different reason. In the mid 80's there was a guy that used to advertise in Hemmings that would make a new tag for your car so you could change the interior or exterior color. This was directed mostly to the Corvette guys as they were the target at the time, but he could make tags for Tri-5 Chevy's as well. I owned a 57 Chevy Bel Air in the mid 80's and was thinking about changing the color from the original white (BOOOORING) to something else. At the time, changing colors was kind of frowned upon since it now made the car "modified". At the time, the "Classic Chevy Club" (THE club for tri-5 Chevy's), deducted points for changing interior or exterior colors. I believe the Corvette groups also did the same. Therefore, if one could change colors and still show the correct code on the Trim Tag, no points would be deducted.

Times have changed since then and changing tags to match your "new" color has gone by the wayside! Now people are changing tags to bilk unsuspecting buyers. It's become BIG business and there have been equally, BIG problems when these tags are exposed. One guy got a punch in the nose at a Corvette show a few years ago!! So you can see where things can get ugly.

If you have any concerns or the originallity of your tag, post pictures of the VIN and the Trim Tag here or on one of the other Camaro WEB sites and the experts will be able to help you out.


Decoding/Numbers / Re: 1967 Cowl Tag Date and Engine Build Date
« on: April 26, 2006, 02:37:32 PM »

I NEVER get involved in discussions on Trim Tag authenticity because there are enough guys out there that know the facts and can report as such. And, as a matter of fact, Kurt is one of the best, as is Daniel.

That being said, when you first posted a picture of your tag, I knew that it wasn't factory, but didn't say anything. I didn't want to be the bearer of bad news for you, so I chose to leave it alone. I learned long ago that if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all.

Although I can understand and appreciate your wanting to believe the tag to be correct, due to the fact that you've owned the car for so many years, you have to realize that even in the early 80's, there were people manufacturing reproduction tags for these cars, and reproduction Trim Tags, even today, are fairly easy to spot if you've seen a lot of them over the years. I won't go into details, but there are subtle nuances in the originals that are left off the reproductions.

Fisher Body manufactured hundreds of cars a day and as a general rule, didn't make this kind of mistake. Yes, mistakes were made with Trim Tags, but things like an incorrect paint code, or an incorrect interior code (of which my car has), but not an incorrect date code. You have to understand the process of which these tags were produced to realize why this type of mistake wouldn't happen, and believe me, Kurt knows.

I'm sure no one here will ever be able to pursuade you that your tag is incorrect, just as you won't ever be able to pursuade the guys here at the CRG that it IS correct. But the most important thing is that you enjoy your car no matter what and be willing to listen. Most of the guys associated with this site have 40 years or more of experience with First Generations Camaro's, and have a lot of knowledge to offer. They also value YOUR input as well, so please don't take all this personally. I would hate to see you frustrated to the point where you no longer post.

Keep the lines of communications open with these guys even if it's NOT on the forum!!


Decoding/Numbers / Re: 15 x 6 YS Code Rally Wheel
« on: April 24, 2006, 03:10:44 AM »

Yup. 5 on 4-3/4"

With a few exceptions, Chevrolet has used the same bolt pattern almost forever!


Decoding/Numbers / Re: 15 x 6 YS Code Rally Wheel
« on: April 24, 2006, 01:20:28 AM »

"YS" wheels were used on 69 Full Size with Disk Brakes and 70 Full Size (except wagons) with Disk Brakes. The wheel is 15x6 and has an offset of .06"


Restoration / Re: ac delco voltage regulator part number for 68 L34?
« on: April 23, 2006, 05:09:37 AM »

here are two pictures showing the location of the stampings. The first is a full shot showing the whole regulator, and the second a blow up of the stampings. (Don't worry, you're not seeing things. They are 2 different regulators with the first being a May, 1969 unit, and the second being a June, 1968 unit.)

As for "how" they were stamped, I'm assuming they had some kind of gang stamp like used on the engines/transmissions, etc... Much smaller but basically the same concept.


Restoration / Re: ac delco voltage regulator part number for 68 L34?
« on: April 17, 2006, 01:39:11 AM »

If you mean a date code for Voltage Regulators, yes there is. It will be in a format like "8E" which would be "Year & Month". In this example, "8E" would be May, 1968. However, it could also mean May of 1978, May of 1988 or May of 1998. Voltage regulators were still available from the dealer long after these cars were built and AC Delco continued to be the supplier. I don't think they're available "new" any longer though.


Restoration / Re: ac delco voltage regulator part number for 68 L34?
« on: April 16, 2006, 04:15:46 PM »
Thanks John. THen I'll assume that the riveted ones are "over the counter" replacements. Which would make sense since I've not seen very many of those...


Restoration / Re: Multi leaf springs
« on: April 16, 2006, 03:48:21 AM »

Okay, the "spring rate" signifies the extra weight options add or subtract from the normal weight of the car. For instance, you'll notice in the chart below (from the September, 1968 P&A 34) that some options add weight while others reduce weight. In your case, 84 equals 84 pounds more than the normal rear weight of the car. The same goes for the front. In your case, your options added an additional 259 pounds of weight to the front of the car. Now, because of this added weight, the "normal" springs would have to be replaced with others so the ride height would remain the same. This is how the factory determined the spring rates to keep the ride height at the normal level.

The F41 option is actually "Special Purpose, Front and Rear Springs" which gave the car a bit more harsher ride compared to the "Standard" springs. The  G31 option was "Heavy Duty REAR Springs" only, and I believe was used to eliminate wheel hop off the line. This was a racing options and very few street cars came this way, unless of course, the owner wanted to go racing!!

The Spring Codes like "BL" and "BM" were used at the factory to identify the spring. Basically it kept the line workers from having to go search for the correct spring. All major assemblies had some kind of code either stamped into the part, cast into the part or had a sticker affixed to the part to help the line workers quickly identify what they needed so they didn't waste time searching!

By the way, sorry for the "bleed through", but the pages in the P&A aren't that thick!!

So anyway, does this help?



Originality / Re: SS Hupcaps
« on: April 15, 2006, 04:57:43 PM »

The P&A 34 ("Chevrolet parts and Accessories Catalog for 1960-1969 Corvair, 1962-1969 Chevy II, 1964-1969 Chevelle and 1967-1969 Camaro") was a "dealer only" book showing the parts numbers for all the items on your car. It was accompanied by another book called the P&A 25 ("Chevrolet Passenger Parts Illustration and Special Information Catalog") that was a book of exploded parts diagrams. Together, these two books are what the parts counterman (or woman...) at the dealership used to look up and order replacement parts for your car. My particular P&A 34 and P&A 25 are from September, 1968 that I've had for some 30 odd years!

Finding these things is just happenchance. I've seen them on ebay VERY sporatically (one or two in twice as many years), but some of the larger automotive book dealers sometimes have them. Here are a few you can check with:

Faxon Auto Literature (800-458-2734)
Chewning's Auto Literature in Georgia (sorry, no number)
Bob Johnson's Auto Literature (800-334-0688)
Douglas Vogel Auto Literature (734-424-9336)
Paper Plus Auto Literature (616-781-9068)
Walter Miller (800-426-0902)
Paul Politis Auto Literature Shop (800-526-7099)

Now, these phone numbers are fairly old and seeing how area codes change every few hours lately, you may have to do some detective work! And I'm not sure just how many of these guys are still in business, but give it a shot. Won't hurt to try, but be prepared, the one's I did see on ebay went for HUGE $$$$!!! Especially the sets like I have. The last ones I saw was a matched set from 1970 and they went for over $700.00! And this was a few years ago. I can just imagine what they're going for now!!!

Edit: A quick check of ebay shows a P&A 34 from October, 1967. No P&A 25 though.

Good luck...

General Discussion / Re: 1968 Camaro RS
« on: April 15, 2006, 04:12:48 AM »
I ran the numbers myself, the VIN shows it to be a 6 cyl. car. So that alone rules out the RS.

While I agree that your car is probably not an RS, you can't rule out the RS option just because the engine's not a V8. The RS option was available on ANY Camaro regardless of the engine size.

The cowl tag don't belong to the car, it shows 12437, and a Ermine White exterior, and Teal Blue Interior.

The Cowl tag will ALWAYS show 12437 no matter what engine is installed. The VIN is the only true indicator of a V8 or 6 cylinder. If it's 123x7, it's a 6, if it's 124x7 it's a V8. Don't go by the Cowl Tag on this one.

10E would be the 5th week of October, 1967. HERE'S a 1967 Calendar for you to look at.

Post the Trim Tag info and your VIN and we can tell you if the tag lines up with the VIN.


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