Messages

1

Research Topics & Reports / Re: Original cowl hood photos needed

« on: February 07, 2024, 10:09:28 PM »

If it would help, I have a cowl hood on my car that I purchased new, in primer, that has the original GM Parts sticker still on it, last time I looked before covering the car for the winter last November.  I bought this Parts Dept. hood from a private owner back in the 1980/81 timeframe to replace my '69 Z's flat hood.  Just how old this hood was when I bought it is unknown.  I never procured/attached the matching underhood insulation and would be happy to take and post whatever photos of it are desired -- please let me know if this would help and I'll do that.

2

Maintenance / Re: 302 Z28 Divorced Choke Rod Adjustment

« on: February 07, 2024, 09:45:54 PM »

Thank you, GMAD_Van Nuys, for providing the link to the Holley 4150 repair/adjustment procedures -- very informative.  In reading through it, I noticed there are several carburetor adjustments that require a specific dimensional measurement be achieved for that feature to be adjusted properly.   There is a note in several places that state: "On some models, a specified dimension will be given in the specification table."  Is there a chance you might have this specification table for the 4150 carbs and be able to share it?

3

Maintenance / 302 Z28 Divorced Choke Rod Adjustment

« on: January 28, 2024, 12:01:05 AM »

The '69 Chevrolet Service Manual provides information on how to adjust the divorced choke rod on Z28 302's (and other Holley 4 barrel equipped V8 engines) on pages 6M-3 and 6M-7.  As written, the procedure is unclear.  On page 6M-3 it says:

    "On all engines except L6 and 2 barrel V-8 engines, hold the choke valve closed and push the rod downward to contact stop -- the top of the rod should be even with the bottom of the hole in the choke lever.  On L6 and 2 barrel engines, hold the choke valve closed and pull rod upward to end of travel.  The bottom of the rod should be even with the the top of the hole in choke lever."

There is no specific reference to Holley 4 barrel equipped engines in the 6M-3 page write up.  Therefore, should the choke rod be adjusted (bent) in the same manner as the above description for the L6 and 2 barrel engines, so that the bottom of the rod is even with the top of the hole in the lever?  I ask this because the 302 choke rod operates similarly to the L6 and 2 barrel engines -- namely, the choke rod is pulled upwards to hit the end of its travel.

Then, on page 6M-7 it says:

    "With Rochester 4MV and Holley Carburetors, install the choke rod and adjust as necessary.  Be sure choke valve moves freely from full open to full closed position."

I assume the instruction on page 6M-7 refers to the procedure on page 6M-3 which, unfortunately, does not mention Holley 4 barrel equipped engines.

Is the L6 and 2 barrel V8 procedure the correct choke adjustment procedure others have used on faithfully restored 302's that results in clean starts when the throttle is pumped just once to set the choke, without having to pump the throttle multiple times, before turning the key to start the engine? 

If anyone can shed more light on this maintenance/adjustment procedure for 302 z28's , I would be very grateful.

4

Originality / Re: Ignition Coil Primary Wire Connections -- Guide, Support, etc.

« on: December 24, 2023, 06:56:07 PM »

Hi Mitch,

Thanks for looking.  I was a bit surprised to see there are three upturned flanges and one long, narrow tab on the part.  I was expecting to see only two upturned flanges on opposite sides.  Perhaps my memory is failing me.  Is the one you found definitely the style Chevy used in the late 60's?
Chuck

5

Originality / Ignition Coil Primary Wire Connections -- Guide, Support, etc.

« on: December 22, 2023, 09:17:08 PM »

Does anyone know where to obtain the thin, stamped "guide" (or support) that go onto the ignition coil + and - primary terminals?  If I recall, GM used these items on each terminal of the ignition coil for most of their cars from the mid '50's thru the '70's.  These "guides" are the first thing that go onto each coil terminal, followed by the negative wire (from the distributor) and the positive wire (from the harness), and then followed by the #10-32 nut and lockwasher.  These "guides" were made from thin sheet metal (~ 0.020" thick) and had two opposite ends turned up as flanges (about 0.035" high).  These two upturned flanges on the "guide" served to prevent the legs of the wire harness terminals from spreading apart excessively when tightening the #10-32 nut.

I've tried AMK Fasteners and various restoration parts suppliers of replacement coils and they do not have these "guides".  Any help would be appreciated.  Thanks.

6

Originality / 1969 Z28 302 Engine Oil Dipstick Tube Orientation

« on: March 14, 2022, 08:09:41 PM »

There is information on the orientation of the oil dipstick tube in the block published in my copy of the '69 A.I.M. (in UPC 6, Sheet B1). It shows the curved portion/dipstick handle pointing forward and slightly outboard per a notation in View A that reads: 7 deg's, +/- 5 deg's, or roughly towards the left front headlight.  However, I've come across many underhood photos of  supposedly original cars that show in most cases the tube is oriented nearly vertical, such that the upper end of the tube is positioned between the cylinder head and the air pump distribution tube assembly.  Could this be one of those cases where it doesn't really matter how it is oriented as there are many documented examples showing a variety of orientations?

Thanks for the help.

7

Maintenance / Re: Head Gasket Steel Shim Style

« on: February 25, 2021, 12:12:45 AM »

My pistons all mic'd out at 0.022" +/- 0.001" down the hole.  The piston skirts were treated to the abradable coating from Line2Line in Clarkston, MI for a thumb pressure "push fit" into the cylinder, so that should reduce any piston rocking to the least possible amount and contribute to good, long term ring sealing.  Will follow their recommended dyno break-in cycle to optimize the skirt to wall fit.

8

Maintenance / Head Gasket Steel Shim Style

« on: February 24, 2021, 09:08:03 PM »

This is a head gasket preparation question.  I've received all my OEM '69 302 parts back from the machine shop and the block decks required about 0.008" to clean up, with the resulting deck height coming in at 9.011".  For head gaskets, I can choose between the modern Fel-Pro 0.038" composition part, the Chevy p/n 10105117 0.028" composition part, or the '69 OEM 0.016" steel shim part.  Knowing a tight piston to head quench distance (i.e.: "squish") of 0.036"/0.038" helps to fend off detonation, the 0.016" steel shim gasket gets me to this nice 0.038" squish, but the final actual compression ratio comes out to 11.08:1.  Stepping up to the thicker 0.028" Chevy '117 gasket drops the true CR down to 10.8:1 but increases the squish to 0.050".  Since I have used (and plan to continue to use) ACES IV mixed with 93 octane fuel successfully, I believe I can tolerate the 11.08:1 CR the steel shim gasket gives and plan to use it for this assembly.  My question has to do with how best to prep the "old fashioned" steel shim head gasket to avoid long term future coolant leakage.  Back in the day, the only steel shim head gasket prep I am aware of was spraying a light coating or two of aluminum paint on each side of the gasket, letting it dry and then installing/torquing the heads, followed by a retorque after it's first hot start/cool down.  I've heard of some folks laying on a very thin coating of Perma-Tex Gasket Maker (p/n 51813) around the gasket's coolant holes in addition to the aluminum paint spray.

What have others found that work long term for prepping the old style steel shim head gasket?  Thanks a bunch!

I forgot to mention all the "internals" are OEM '69 302 -- the cam, pistons, intake, carb, etc.
Chuck B.

9

Decoding/Numbers / Re: Oil Pan Ident/Date Code Stamping?

« on: April 08, 2020, 11:18:20 PM »

I stripped the paint off the timing cover today and found an obvious month/year date code: 4  69 (see pic's) which seems to make sense for my V0513DZ POP Engine Code.  I'm a bit surprised that the timing cover is date stamped but the oil pan is not.  There is a possibility that my oil pan is not original to the car as I know the 1st owner installed a deeper sump oil pan in 1970.  What I can't recall is whether he had the original oil pan modified for a deeper sump, or he bought a new 'ready-made' deep sump pan.  I seem to recall the deeper oil pan was on the engine when I bought the car in '79.  What I don't recall is whether or not I bought a new, correct replacement 302 pan or he included the original pan (if he had it) at the time of the car's transfer to me.

Have others found a month/year date code on their timing cover and/or oil pan?

10

Decoding/Numbers / Re: Oil Pan Ident/Date Code Stamping?

« on: April 05, 2020, 09:42:28 PM »

There is a possibility this number/letter stamping could possibly be the last 4 digits of the base (before any of the internal baffles are spot welded into it) oil pan stamping part number, along with the change letter of the engineering drawing in effect at the time it was stamped.  If this is correct, then the number/letter combo has no relevance to indicating it is a 302 pan as opposed to any generic small block pan without the internal baffles.

11

Decoding/Numbers / Oil Pan Ident/Date Code Stamping?

« on: April 04, 2020, 11:24:15 PM »

While in the process of refreshing the 302, I stripped the paint off the oil pan and discovered these characters - 2252W, located on the underside of the pan, about 2" back from the front face of the pan.  Does anyone know what this code refers to? 

12

Decoding/Numbers / Re: Block Casting '010 -- 1969 vs. 1979 Casting Date

« on: April 03, 2020, 05:04:21 PM »

Many thanks to those who have offered their input.  This is new territory for me and I appreciate the responses.

To respond to some of your recent comments and questions:
1. I do have a letter from the 1st owner of the car that states the circumstances of the block swap without a copy of the WRO to support it.  That letter is notarized and is in my documentation collection.
2.  Stubbing accepted the veracity of that notarized letter in his appraisal as documentation of the block swap.  Perhaps this was not the most appropriate action on his part, but that's what he did.
3.  The replacement '010 block has a casting date of D-14-0 to support the late spring/early summer timeframe it was installed by the dealer.

The more thought I give this situation and the thoughtful comments I have received, and given the fact that my intent has never been to pass off something as original when it definitely would not be the case, I'm going to revert back to my original position I've held for the past 41 years and just enjoy the car as it is.

Again, thanks to all.

13

Decoding/Numbers / Re: Block Casting '010 -- 1969 vs. 1979 Casting Date

« on: April 03, 2020, 01:03:28 AM »

I haven't driven the 200 miles to see this E-9-9 block in person as of yet.  Am waiting for the seller to call me back with answers to a few questions I had for him, and to ask him for a few photos of it.  In the meantime, I thought I would explain to everyone why I'm looking for an early May, '69 '010 block.  The first time I met Jerry M was at Carlisle (in 2000).  I had the opportunity to explain my situation to him.  My original block was replaced in mid 1970 under warranty when the 1st owner had the car.  He did not save a copy of that Warranty Repair Order (WRO).  Later that same summer of '70, together, we pulled the engine to prep it for amateur drag racing, which included decking the block, which removed the "CE" stamping.  I circled back to him in 1979 and bought the car, knowing all of this history as he was a friend of mine.  So, here I am, with a bona-fide warranty replacement block installed by the selling dealer, with no paperwork to document the swap and no "CE" stamping on the block.  When I explained all this to Jerry his immediate suggestion was to look for a block with a casting date that closely precedes my POP engine build date (May 13).  I did not seriously consider acting on that advice -- until now.   Back in 2008 I had Jim Stubbing of Heartbeat City (I lived nearby at that time) appraise the car and the appraisal correctly states the engine block has been replaced under warranty.  Given that, the car appraised for $52,500 in '08.  If this E-9-9 '010 block I have a line on checks out to be legitimate and sound, would having this block (but likely never installing it into the car) help to protect or increase the overall value of the car in the future?   If so, are we talking a 5% increase, or more than 5%?  Or not add any value at all?  Thanks.

14

General Discussion / Re: Block Search -- ebay Advertiser

« on: March 30, 2020, 11:21:46 PM »

I truly can't thank everyone enough who responded to my posted inquiry.  After doing the recommended search on the CRG website one of you suggested, I read the transcript of the court case against Mr. Gregory Long, and the sentencing handed down to him for defrauding/stealing from unsuspecting Camaro enthusiasts.  Once again, I find myself expressing my gratitude for very high caliber of everyone who is a member of the CRG Forum -- THANK YOU ALL.  Needless to say, I'm not going to do any business with Mr. Long of Angola Indiana.

15

General Discussion / Block Search -- ebay Advertiser

« on: March 30, 2020, 08:06:17 PM »

Is anyone familiar with this ebay advertiser?:  thegmparts <thegmp_mu3847nffg@members.ebay.com>

In my search for an appropriately date coded block to replace the '010 CE/NOM in my '69 Z, I've made contact with him -- Gregory is his name.  He's located in Angola IN and apparently has been servicing the Corvette/Camaro guys with his blocks, engines, etc for many years.  When I called and asked him about a casting date coded block I was looking for, he stated he currently has a couple appropriately date coded '010 block that would go with my mid-May '69 POP date.  He also stated he has correctly gang re-stamped blocks to match both the POP code and VIN stamp for many collectors around the country.  Not sure I would go that far, but I would like to know what the "skinny" is on this fellow and if he's an honest businessman who represents his products legitimately.  Thanks.