CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => Originality => Topic started by: ccargo on November 02, 2005, 03:16:14 AM
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Any design related differences between the 68 and 69 front spoiler ???
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Yes. The valances are different and the shape of the spoiler where it mounts to the valance is different.
Rick H.
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There were 2 68 front spoiler designs. The first design, used for most of '68 production, was smaller and fastened only to the lower body panel, no braces. The second design was larger and had additional braces for mounting.
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I posted a related question on the restoration page but this is a good dialog here. The question is for early production spoliers ( mine was March 68) what type of fasteners were used? My ASM has no page for this option and I have none of the original fittings. I assume they were phillips screws with a captive washer or SEM indented hex with a captive washer size 10??
Cheers
Arno
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When i got my car the original spoiler was gone but what remained was pieces of the plastic under six regular 5/16 head self tapping screws. All the holes where the support braces would attach were untouched and still had paint in them so i knew i didnt have the second type larger spoiler and replaced it with the short textured one. My car was in storage for 15 years prior to me getting it and was mostly original & unmolested with 58xxx showing on the speedo so i would guess those self tappers were original but i suppose the original owner could have added the spoiler. Hope that helps and glad i found this place!!! :)
Chris
1968 Sequioa Green Camaro SS
396/325 M20
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Hi Chris
I think your spoiler screws may have been replaced at some time. Based on input from local owners with original cars it seems they could be #10 Philips head machine srcrews with a hex nut/captive washer on the backside.
Cheers
Arno
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Arno,
Do you have any pics of what the screws you are referring to look like? Do you know if the originals had any type of markings and was this for the first type spoiler or second type spoiler?
Thanks Chris.
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I have 1969 camaro with the spoiler option, the original front spoiler screws are 1/4-14x 5/8 7/16 AF with. 75 OD flanged washer. If you go www.amkproducts.com, part# B-12101, they have this screw which is the same as the original except for the head markings, I don"t know if the 1968 used the same screw I would think it would be similar.
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On 68 1st design spoilers there were no struts. As far as I know the spoiler was attached with 10-24 X 1/2" machine screws to the valance panel. The nut had a captive washer.
I think 69 had these screws plus the 1/4 hex bolts for the struts, correct?
Starting in the 1980's GM had a crossover repair part PN# is somewhere in my garage, that allowed 68 and 69 to be replaced by one part.
Arno
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Original '69 spoiler fasteners were:
Spoiler-to-lower valance - #9417075 screw (#10-24 x 3/4" with captured washer) and #10-24 nut with captured washer #3759924; two center screws were the standard car license bracket fasteners.
Brace-to-fender and subframe - #3847757 screw (5/16"-18 x 3/4" with indented hex head and captured washer) with plain nut and split lockwasher.
Brace-to-spoiler - #3847758 screw (5/16"-18 x 7/8" with indented hex head and captured washer) with plain nut and split lockwasher.
Many spoilers have been broken/torn off over the years and replaced with non-standard fasteners, but the above are what they were originally built with.
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John
What is the dia of the captured washer on the # 9417075 screw and the dia of the captured washer on the # 3759924 nut, I found the nut in the AMK catalog with that part number, they list it as, 10-24 3/8 AF .45 od washer and .19 OAH, is this correct ?
Randy
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I don't know the captured washer diameter on the screw offhand, but what you found sounds reasonable to me; AMK is about as close as you're going to find.
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John
Is the 10 - 24 screw a philips head? Cad or probably black phos finish?
I think the captive washer on the screw was correct, more than 0.4" D won't fit in the angled flange on the 68 spolier.
Arno
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The 7075 screw had a hex head.
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Original '69 spoiler fasteners were:
Spoiler-to-lower valance - #9417075 screw (#10-24 x 3/4" with captured washer) and #10-24 nut with captured washer #3759924; two center screws were the standard car license bracket fasteners.
Brace-to-fender and subframe - #3847757 screw (5/16"-18 x 3/4" with indented hex head and captured washer) with plain nut and split lockwasher.
Brace-to-spoiler - #3847758 screw (5/16"-18 x 7/8" with indented hex head and captured washer) with plain nut and split lockwasher.
Many spoilers have been broken/torn off over the years and replaced with non-standard fasteners, but the above are what they were originally built with.
Hi John,
Could you possibly post some images of these screws & fasteners? I'd like to see the markings and
mounting particulars if possible. I believe you supplied me with an image of the screw for the center
support to sub-frame a few months ago.
Steve
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Steve - the photo below is typical of the 3847757-8; they're used all over the car; don't have a photo of the 7075.
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Steve - the photo below is typical of the 3847757-8; they're used all over the car; don't have a photo of the 7075.
John, if you see this post, would you please re-post the picture of the 3847757? The link appears to be broken.
Thank you,
Scott
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Here's the 3847757 - the original pic apparently disappeared back when the site was hacked.
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Thanks John!
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When i got my car the original spoiler was gone but what remained was pieces of the plastic under six regular 5/16 head self tapping screws. All the holes where the support braces would attach were untouched and still had paint in them so i knew i didnt have the second type larger spoiler and replaced it with the short textured one. My car was in storage for 15 years prior to me getting it and was mostly original & unmolested with 58xxx showing on the speedo so i would guess those self tappers were original but i suppose the original owner could have added the spoiler. Hope that helps and glad i found this place!!! :)
Chris
1968 Sequioa Green Camaro SS
396/325 M20
I'm with you, Chris. I think the self-tapping sheet metal screws are the right ones for the early '68 spoiler, not the machine screws and nuts. The few original examples I have seen (pretty hard to find) have had self-tappers.
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My 07C '68 had the same scenario......when I got the car in 1972 the spoiler had already been torn off and there were pieces of the plastic under the screws. The screws were hex head machine screws with hex nut/captive washers on the backside. The holes in the valence were clean holes.....no signs of threads left by self tapping screws.
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I hope this is the correct spot for this...here goes. Would an early build (10c) '69 Camaro have a '69 front spoiler or the second build '68 front spoiler. I know the rear should be a '68 but I haven't been able to find any specific info regarding the front, such as "all '69 model year Camaros with the D80 option came with the '69 front spoiler regardless of production date". Or are the late '68 and the '69 front spoiler the same?
Thanks.
Doug
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All '69s built with D80 used the '69 front spoiler for the entire production run.
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Thanks William. That was the direction I was leaning.
Doug
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Would anyone know the AMK numbers for the early 68 valence screws and captive nuts. I am taking these are the correct items for the early spoiler? Thanks
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Would anyone know the AMK numbers for the early 68 valence screws and captive nuts. I am taking these are the correct items for the early spoiler? Thanks
Scoop,
Here is as close as your going to find in the AMK catalog, and I am comparing them to my original hardware.
Screws - GM part # 9417075 (there is no equivalent number in the AMK catalog)
AMK # B-10411, Page # 115 (This screw is as close to my original as I could find...The only difference is that the AMK screw has no head markings and my original has a head marking of a N & L that is overstruck.)
Nuts - GM part # 3759924 (There is an AMK equivalent)
AMK # B-13507, Page# 51.
This hardware I am comparing to is from my 07C car.
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Thank You very much