CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => Originality => Topic started by: john302 on March 19, 2009, 03:16:20 AM
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Did all 69 RS camaros have the stainless trim around the front turn signal lens? I heard that some late /early car did not use the stainless trim? Thanks John ???
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John,
Attached pic is my 69 01C Norwood built RS. No stainless trim - VIN 9N581767
Richard
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Rally Sport only. Try and find an NOS set!! Last set I saw went for well over $400.00
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Try and find an NOS set!! Last set I saw went for well over $400.00
Here's a pair (not RS) that was recently on Ebay...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1969-Camaro-NOS-GM-Parking-Turn-Lamps-69-SS-Z28-COPO_W0QQitemZ370172446023QQcmdZViewItemQQptZMotors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories?hash=item370172446023&_trksid=p4506.c0.m245&_trkparms=65%3A13%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318
Paul
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Richard,
Nice blue RS. Could you send or post some photos of your entire car. My car is glacier blue and I am collecting photos of cars with nice paint to inspire me. I am saving money for paint.
Thanks
Tim
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Does any know if a 11d rs z built in California would have the trim? Thanks John
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Richard,
Nice blue RS. Could you send or post some photos of your entire car. My car is glacier blue and I am collecting photos of cars with nice paint to inspire me. I am saving money for paint.
Thanks
Tim
Tim,
Here's a couple - keep moving forward - $1 and 1 step at a time - no worries.
Richard
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second time you hijacked my thread!!!!!!!!!
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I apologize, not my intent as I thought I provided some guidance in my orignal response. Admitedly, not adhering to proper forum ettiquete by responding to Tim's request in your thread is an error on my part and I apologize.
I'll defer to others to add further clarification to your original question.
Richard
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Does any know if a 11d rs z built in California would have the trim? Thanks John
My 01C built Z/28 RS built in California does not have the trim. I don't know when it was used for sure. I remember reading about it somewhere but haven't been able to find where I read it. If memory serves me right it was either used early in '69 production then dropped or only became available late in '69 production; I want to say the latter.
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My 09C ('69) Z28/RS does not have stainless trim around the front parking lights, and hasn't since I purchased it in '77 or thereabouts; My lower valence was replaced though, prior to my purchase (it still had the GM sticker on the back) so the parking lights could also have been replaced ???
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WELL! Someone just paid over $500 for an NOS set of lenses on ePay :o
Nuch
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That person was ME! If the RS didnt use them,I will put them back on epay. I am starting to think that LA built cars might have not used them? The car is a 11d LA built RS. anymore info on this subject? Thanks John
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My personal experience is that I have never noticed a trim ring on the front parking / turn signal lens of any '69 RS. When I purchased my '69 RS in Nov 1991, there was no trim ring on the lens. My car is an 01C Norwood build which doesn't directly help your LA build research. However, the front of my car iis the same as the picture in my original response to your question above (in the pic, the front bumper is not installed). I'm not saying conclusively that trim rings weren't used; just that I have never personally seen one on any '69 RS that I can recall.
Also, checking my copy of the '69 Factory Assembly Instruction Manual, Sections Z21 Style Trim (page 453) and Z22 Rally Sport (pages 454-467), I do not see any reference to a trim ring on the front parking light / turn signal lens.
On page 454 in the Z22 section, is the following:
"UPC 12 ELECTRICAL; 12C FRONT LAMPS (direction signal, flasher, park lamps) - Assemblies same as production. See Parts List or Bill of Materials for Part Number."
Refering back to Section UPC 12, page 153, the parking / turn signal assembly is shown, as an assembly, part number 916911. (Same part number as on the eBay listing posted above.) No reference is made in UPC 12 to a trim ring either, at least if there is, I don't see it.
The note "assemblies same as production" indicates to me that there is no difference between the front park lamp assemblies between a RS or non RS car - which is consistent with my personal observations over the years.
Just my two cents worth....that and $1.50 will buy you a cup of coffee. Good luck.
Richard
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The original front Valence and parking lamps in my 69 Z10 does have trim rings around the lens.
Kris
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The note "assemblies same as production" indicates to me that there is no difference between the front park lamp assemblies between a RS or non RS car - which is consistent with my personal observations over the years.
There is a difference! My February 1969 Chevrolet P&A states this...
2.585 LAMP ASSY., Parking and Direction Signal
69 CAMARO w/R.S. . . . . . . . . . . 916810
69 CAMARO (exc. R.S.) . . . . . . . . . 916911
Paul
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The note "assemblies same as production" indicates to me that there is no difference between the front park lamp assemblies between a RS or non RS car - which is consistent with my personal observations over the years.
There is a difference! My February 1969 Chevrolet P&A states this...
2.585 LAMP ASSY., Parking and Direction Signal
69 CAMARO w/R.S. . . . . . . . . . . 916810
69 CAMARO (exc. R.S.) . . . . . . . . . 916911
Paul
We may be answering our own question - perhaps the change occurred after Jan 69 (your P&A is Feb 69)? Also, just a general question, just because a part number was assigned does that unoquevicallly mean that the piece went into production.
If anyone has a picture of an original car with this trim on it, I'd sure like to see it - because I've never seen it.
Richard
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On page 454 in the Z22 section, is the following:
"UPC 12 ELECTRICAL; 12C FRONT LAMPS (direction signal, flasher, park lamps) - Assemblies same as production. See Parts List or Bill of Materials for Part Number."
The note "assemblies same as production" indicates to me that there is no difference between the front park lamp assemblies between a RS or non RS car - which is consistent with my personal observations over the years.
Wherever you see that notation on the non-illustrated parts page, it means that the RPO part assembles to the car the same way and with the same fasteners as the "base car" part, but it's a different part with a different part number than the base car part; in this case, the parking lamps with the stainless rim on the lens.
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If anyone has a picture of an original car with this trim on it, I'd sure like to see it.
Richard
Richard -
Do you have a 1969 Camaro original sales brochure? If so, on the cover is a green RS/SS with the trim on it. Also, on pages 6 & 7 is a yellow RS convertible with the trim on it.
Paul
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As 01/02/69 the ordering info equipment description for RS no longer mentions "bright trim" around the parking lamp lenses.
I have seen originals with the trim; the circumference of the lens is painted argent. I added them to my Norwood Feb 69 Z/28-RS.
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If anyone has a picture of an original car with this trim on it, I'd sure like to see it.
Richard
Richard -
Do you have a 1969 Camaro original sales brochure? If so, on the cover is a green RS/SS with the trim on it. Also, on pages 6 & 7 is a yellow RS convertible with the trim on it.
Paul
Richard -
I forgot to mention there are lots of non-R/S car photos in the same brochure without the trim. :)
Paul
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Roger that,
thanks guys for the info. Does the trim ring show up anywhere in the AIM?
RT
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FWIW: My 04C Z10 and 12 B RS/Z both have park lamp lenses with stainless trim and argent silver paint. Paint can't be seen from the front of the car so if you were not specifically looking for it you would never know. Thought it was overspray or something added by an "artistic" past owner until I looked at the other car and they were both painted. As such there may be more survivor/low mile cars out there with these lenses than what is currently assumed.
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That person was ME! If the RS didnt use them,I will put them back on epay. I am starting to think that LA built cars might have not used them? The car is a 11d LA built RS. anymore info on this subject? Thanks John
Good thing these weren't correct for my non-RS car or you would have bid a lot higher. I had them bookmarked for a lot more than you paid. ;D
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I just pulled Jerry MacNeish's 1969 fact book; I recalled from his book info on this topic.
According the Jerry, "Early production rally sports have directional lenses trimmed with bright metal rings. The outside of the lens is painted Argent Silver. These were discontinued prior to January, 1969".
There is always the possibility of deviations to this. If you have an early build survivor or unrestored car with the Argent silver painted on the back side of the lenses, and/or still have your original bright trim, please post pictures and let us know the build date and VIN of your car.
My 05A Norwood RS had clear lenses and no bright trim.
Thanks
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My 02D Norwood X-33 Z/28 (non-RS) was apparently mis-built with leftover RS parking lights - neither the lamp assemblies nor the lenses have ever been off the car (except I replaced a bulb in one), and both have the bright rings and argent silver on the outside of the lenses.
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JohnZ,
Very interesting...you're probably correct in that leftover material was used up before or during the changeover.
Anyone else with an early build car with the Argent sliver painted front directional lens?
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John since your car is an X33 with all the other chrome trim wouldn't it have the same park lights as a RS ?
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John since your car is an X33 with all the other chrome trim wouldn't it have the same park lights as a RS ?
Nope - the Z-21 Style Trim package (which makes it an X33) didn't include the bright trim on the parking lights; that was an early RS-only feature.