CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => Originality => Topic started by: David K on September 13, 2022, 08:03:16 PM
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From Hoopers 69 book. Anyone know what R is for? I searched first..
F is available too? What’s F for?
Are there more?
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Hoopers books are worthless. They show MANY wrong restos. Toss it in the trash.
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That doesn’t answer my question. But if any of your books from 1991 to today have the correct information, please by all means link a copy here for me and everyone else to purchase.
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PBT are the Paint Body and Trim. No R’s have been documented on original cars to date.
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Hoopers books are worthless. They show MANY wrong restos. Toss it in the trash.
Hold off on that folks.....roll them up with a string and use it to start a chimney fire. Now its worth something.
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Thanks Cook…I was just thumbing through it today and the R caught my eye. Not sure what and if it was even for, which is why I asked. I saw an F for sale from reputable online vendors. Was it green or orange? What does F stand for anyway?
https://www.camarocentral.com/1969_Firewall_Inspection_F_Marking_Stamp_p/enc-885a.htm
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That book was Light years ahead of the Evergreen Press 1981 Book Camaro Chevy's Classy Chassis.
Kids and their 'Inner-Nets'
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Thanks Cook…I was just thumbing through it today and the R caught my eye. Not sure what and if it was even for, which is why I asked. I saw an F for sale from reputable online vendors. Was it green or orange? What does F stand for anyway?
https://www.camarocentral.com/1969_Firewall_Inspection_F_Marking_Stamp_p/enc-885a.htm
Possibly used on some other GM make? But here's an old thread that mentions a perceived F stamp - see post #53
http://www.camaros.org/forum/index.php?topic=2346.45
One incorrect interpretation, and the myth is born.
Wouldn't be the first (or likely last) time a vendor was selling items not correct for a first gen Camaro
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Thanks Cook…I was just thumbing through it today and the R caught my eye. Not sure what and if it was even for, which is why I asked. I saw an F for sale from reputable online vendors. Was it green or orange? What does F stand for anyway?
https://www.camarocentral.com/1969_Firewall_Inspection_F_Marking_Stamp_p/enc-885a.htm
David, orange is what is normally seen but green is seen also. Green is believed to have been 2nd shift. Take some time and research before buying/doing as you will save time and money. Some of what I did prior to putting on firewall.
https://www.camaros.net/threads/time-for-another-68-z-28-to-be-restored.182584/page-35#post-2177522
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Thanks for that well road tested marking document. I actually use the orange ones at work, so I’ll probably go that route. Now I just need to find someone to rent me their stamps. It’s a 1 time deal for me. I do know where 1 is on my car. I found this and took a picture during the post wreck restoration.
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David,
If you go thru that book you will see spare tires painted wrong, various wrong stickers added where none should be there, body paint errors, etc. It has been a few years since I had Hoopers book but it was very frustrating to have spent money for such a bad reference. I am in no way exaggerating here.
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Stingray,
I’m talking about the 69 book printed in 1991. Are you?
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I bought the "Big Book of Camaro Data, 1967-1973" on May 2nd, 2001, It was published April 2, 1995. I may have seen one other book of his but do not remember the title. It has been a few decades since I first looked at them.
Jerry MacNeish's books are great. The AIM is a must have. Colvin's "By The Numbers" books are great. Michael Lamm's (I have 5th printing, 1981) book is great too.
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Hope the 69 and 67/68 Legends Manuals rank up there. Lot of work went into them
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I have The Hooper book from 1991, Jerry's book, The new Judges Manual (2022), Colvin's Chevy by the numbers. Each book has its merits and its flaws. Chevrolet by the numbers while extremely accurate has a handful of loopholes and they're based on not enough info, or data points to confirm certain parts. The definitive 1969 Camaro guide, while good at the the time of publishing has some oversights and generalities that do not apply throughout the production year ( which some facts only became known after publishing). I have also gone through the new 1969 Judges legends manual and again good detail on some changes in production, but no part numbers on some changes, and some multiple version or interchanged parts and designs use through production isn't even mentioned for the Z or SS cars. When 100's of thousands of cars are produced and they have quotas to meet on getting cars out the door, they were not holding up many cars because there was a deviation from the norm. The X11 69Z car is rare occurrence , but many others smaller documented issues occurred during the production run. The main issue is these cars are a not "cookie cutter" type car with the many changes that took place, but when many readers see these books they are trying to restore their car thinking well this is the only way it could be done with this one part, because the book doesn't mention other parts or other cars that have different part numbers. I have seen a number of guys remove original parts from their car looking at Jerry's book thinking they were incorrect, to only find out later other cars built around there's to have those same parts they removed.
So to Pacecar, the Legends Manuals offer more info and a guide as the other books, but it really takes a lot of investigative work to pin down the right info on when a car was built and other similar time frame examples. the books are helpful, but still have a ways to go.
The R F stamps in Hoopers book was something that should not have been included. as Cook mentions no other examples have been found. As mentioned Vendors can sell anything, so don't trust them to get it right.
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Bullitt,
Thanks for the clarification on the stamps, which is why I asked in the first place. So no R or F stamps for me. But I never saw an F stamp on any car, just the R. I’ve heard about F and saw it for sale, so again just curious. Maybe I should get the entire alphabet…………..
And yes, every book has its merits and some bit of misinformation. But I believe the authors did their best with what they had at the time of publication; therefore I see no reason to bash their efforts.
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No worries. I am not bashng their effort, only the explanation when something is pointed out, the authors many times seem to think they have the final say, and should not be questioned. Again a disclaimer to let readers or enthusiasts know that there were deviations and things are not as black and white as some of the books seem to make it out. The effort is genuine and it takes A LOT of time and energy to put together so much accurate info. I think the Camaro word is better off with the books out there, even if there is a small amount of error involved. I guess from those in the know a small bit of error is to be expected, just like when they built the cars... 😃
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So how do I make a backwards P for my car or is that a poorly stamped B? See the previous page. I’m so confused. 🧐🫣🤔🤦♂️🫤
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David, It looks like an upside down P to me.
Mike
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So how do I make a backwards P for my car or is that a poorly stamped B? See the previous page. I’m so confused. 🧐🫣🤔🤦♂️🫤
Some had many others did not. Unless your car had it I would not worry about it.
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Mine did….hence yes….I find it interesting that the consensus is there was no real “stamp it in this area” protocol or every car gets a stamp on both sides. I only remember 1 stamp but have never had the ac box off the wall. Wacky.