CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => Restoration => Topic started by: Mike S on February 12, 2020, 01:28:35 PM
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I was taking inventory for what hardware might have to be replaced if I decided to restore the original 67 LOS coupe, and while reading the 67 AIM something puzzled me. In the attached picture I see mention 'Spring washer (when used'). I checked my original 04B LOS and restpred 05B NOR and the washers exist on all 4 mount points and have the indented bolts. The question is, when would those spring washers not be used?
Mike
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To clarify, you have that special spring washer in addition to the larger regular flat one #11? I think my 11B LOS L48 just had the larger flat washers.
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Hi Pete,
Correct, I see the larger washer and the smaller 'spring' washer under the bolt heads.
What year is your car?
Mike
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The special spring washer (P/N 3914049) was only used on the #2 and #3 body mounts. The drawing showing the mounts is "typical", meaning it represents the way the mounts need to be installed.
Ed
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What's confusing, Ed, is there are no other bushing assemblies like the ones for #2 & #3 on the car to make that note in the AIM.
Mike
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I'm not sure what you mean Mike. There's also body mount number 1, which doesn't use the special washer.
Ed
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Hi Pete,
Correct, I see the larger washer and the smaller 'spring' washer under the bolt heads.
What year is your car?
Mike
67. I'm going off memory and could be mistaken. It's in restoration, so I can't go take a look, plus it's disassembled at this point.
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I thought that too Ed, but the radiator mounting doesn't look like the body mount in that a separate nut is used instead, and the bolt approach direction is opposite.
Mike
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Looks like the repro kits include that spring washer for the #2 and #3 points. Here's the one HBC sells
https://www.heartbeatcitycamaro.com/store/product/19631/67-68-Camaro-Firebird-Nova-Subframe-%26-Core-Support-Body-Bolt-Kit-Correct/
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Hi Pete,
Correct, I see the larger washer and the smaller 'spring' washer under the bolt heads.
What year is your car?
Mike
67. I'm going off memory and could be mistaken. It's in restoration, so I can't go take a look, plus it's disassembled at this point.
Guess it’s possible Pete but believe the norm would be bolt and two washers on 2 & 3 as Ed was alluding to.
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Note that you can't always take the AIM as gospel. Some of the notes and illustrations are for "reference" purposes only and may not reflect the "exact" way things were done.
Ed
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The last gospel I used to listen to was from the Reverend Billy Sol Hargis :)
You may remember him, Ed :)
Thanks!
Mike
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Good afternoon
I too am in the process of getting ready to replace my sub frame bushings. I have a question about the 67 mounting bolts in spots 2 & 3. I was able to get the bolts out and they don't look like the ones you see in replacement kits. They look like the bolts for the radiator support, only larger. Could they be the bolts that were noted in the revisions sect of the AIM, part # 3901305? I'll try to get some pictures.
Thanks, John
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Sorry about the upside down pictures :-[
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Those are the same style that came on my 67 04B LOS & 05B Nor
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Thanks Mike. They sure looked original by the condition of the bushings, but all the kits I've seen show a different style of bolt. Again thanks.
John
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When I spoke to a rep from AMK she told me their hardware was made using the last design specs available. I believe the body bolts we see available today are based on what she said. I think some time in 67 the bolt head design changed from the indent head to the flat head.
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The only type I’ve noted for 2 & 3 subframes are this type and have noted them on numerous including at least one 67. Post 252 dated 3/14/10 page 17.
https://www.camaros.net/forums/133-build-projects/182584-time-another-68-z-28-restored-17.html
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Those are the type I referred to as flathead. I suspect they were used later starting in 67. Just a guess.
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Here is a shot of an original spring washer bolt and flat washer.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/i0XioXqOQNsRKg1gJzghJ7vVFYKHqq1v3KmstB4VYpROZkdGwQjY_IEjt-a_gXnHz6N1CfAIJeJ8nhAwmsscwOycTTCHAEPBnWKMyvOjuCAcBgM4snXrSXYvE56kNBg050sqyUA8HCaS617Xm2tcrBnwGAeSP1v5RyKW8sop3eO4az9plGTd1g0ziSngA3L0VlxH8x28oLm7Pi_p84BxJBDs4MI57M1n_iOdIqq4_N1hVJcz0Z_rw0yupzKJEC94qyzBS5cKaBEAoR2S3g4sdGGkiy22awBmEeJpkCjQ-uRszn_834xdYVzNHLO2HG7lMCxI3nU3vchbytG3IoD2gKXlm2NVQS2hzgAy8mGiyiK7LImEu7oeq2KZ8adoh3UwkAh3ZsNfQ9_oe0WLm0oEIZV74GKwu2O6ldfOWPKaNbic8vr8EdhlMD_vnhs0k5kY0VaP6M5JVyYNLpXCNwVsyT9oesZHEOhtlZiJn_VMzyF1Q-M48WL5Y5DXmfF68j9ax4BK-BvDQwkgtHhX9maiVzuUzi9tfmRLwVN98g_MgYYzdfb7rs6JZL1-AbHE0hD-UWdU5gzpQxC6DZZFY7Sky6LUG8eHhaoP9I8OTYL2V3ERGlpHoo9Qus3eqVn3hr4SQ9t3he58pLU4mmXisTgZ6m9XNghjmBUx6H810k0E2oUX6xyc0tRxnIi9eGicRGa7v1nCDJUvybn9FCAvS70h_TGpAMLC5kZgEnKbEY6UktrjWqPa=w1461-h1095-no)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/fhOesL3x0fFubrZAkjbeLhdT9raezgOHMpV237dEdWMhn5KpSWP7ylbPYj__6NMT7W4oT2CCBvwPpHcz0bGhCClIpjSALg9joK7qzaUiYh8a5gHqyzKgX-etD6FpZ100rIsUofrP67w_qZagsnTEA9v5mSBY5zY_xlOqeDucrqL6gj_ArxACJrg1QdZ1P7wBk8EWyvQ9IfhZK3TqYFIP3p5_jDvgR7cFXDt2rrQtEoxRMUT-3XKUkNnmfg0x_RJaN7PSTdJrjE6J6nadXylsxJmTLbjdls8gEngpn7_KMOFiqmT585rInQW1GPxBDAjQAdK1pKVrAxNPBCXc-TQAnqgbnUb-tAiqaBTAsGnc5KuuPJ3uuNffngA6pHboGme2YdqFi8RHqBtLhABgwwWOLJuGK5DsCsTGpKKKIMaHJX40HHUz0T--RO_dFOzHVO4IyuX3SZORBwefVTJ6UHcsbMymGus8a9IsvbIQfyb9zZCGXGCIn0BwLZvLkY9epsX8OZwfXkH7tB0_ufnG7thkSUgngrr4sXLMF-tGVmFBwOoEnvNjQATB94Kbmqe8BXfZPwodQ2b8yi9fHCZeNR-ssTJi2WYTCpXprg0br8gonjYX66yIoblpWBE53dcKYd9uThci4SSctXH0h7AsY6jg1TdQ6DbZM461LRn0zQsIHo1pt8-H7kHTud_7zRUgPw16sORG_wkBkRl9P32wYhtV0HZX85tTQqfgA2QOikx1gHyjRoP9=w1461-h1095-no)
This is the complete rad support set up, the clip on the bottom (speed nut) is to keep everything in place while the rad support is put into position.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/YoEKMIMR29d5F8PrC9fyiTQKtRK059qR5jGFrbRJ6GncDhdscQTfDU8NILsABfhCsd95gqWmZ3UNVvCxiSaQzXmfok33guWQL6XO_S1AOc0Wt6De6vaqjLcrsr17DWPI8WROqRdHj16mLD61Gh23ergSq5yAMcUg4_tzCFkugjmcEnavZ1z8SWLGq6XEqA7OtA6ZdewI8mT2P-Rn7LDo2fAscaJHu5RntHDVUsmAAQfzzd21aNFRKLOlsulwZoHjth8GSlcUyvIQtfFewlUkhkiYv9PioWeuUxDScD9-FRQY0DoITpYoL1hZLOqQkaJ8Uq5BAqyuGInAuqJkxUEWX7fnGJ45W8h8BrDYZv0c_MiEzXrf_OE_vnU7k4n_9lkjl3JqgtsxQWgBxSG8yH-FiuSnQ5J0arwxpaCAiIjSCl-l49a0nEV3mBNKHio8w0boirXm9mHUZ7yVDhFJrEotqIQIy6I2UtZ6rSr6AK5kTAiC88Zsvh5Kd0v4_Gicf3ETQ2xvkJ6j7AchrMuEjiEqFnc0ePb0xKMOHxrNzez-bvA_BhUwpIOlwnsJBE7SyVn_jLCw2x3LoEAV1aqVOd3b0onNSboZBFmf2FAh38nmDkx3CETlGF3VRG2DNU8vgDX8m_rlzvJzyHqy914sMnl5jecuzD0w392QXDZgJuKty-5wV7NmsGnCNsEfu0frKTE0f5VT4EAE7cPCzW1MZtAc00QqFLvNXprQUbo2nbqHSUqpGjSz=w500-h375-no)
This last one shows the difference between the rad support bolts -original is the pointed end bolt.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/E38cXuyZISROyL-kfEEMgewRk-z_LpjQvhkU0SfiabCi35YV89Ofxj51VljcJoH2pxWhh-Bi6hADIxAcyiTMC8kTfeCg3KP9QJigXoyNhip8aITw0e432wG_XzOGzuqKI9alRcjaaSIDlvMQU8QNhufQbEt7YNzXdxIQMh1ca9NMdFytqL1iZImzP5epPtp2sYspyHZOW0moSTnJIm0JI-gYIT1k8lXpb58LX9g_v5n0jQRttDAmKn9FPgTcfed7pt-blKOHMxpZ0BLgc08fhLJFAqNkkOGiG_-tQSdl72gB344sztZQ7drXM66fB5wNGwr_dXFeZJHpu4Y3Bv-4rk5eXC-TPGkS02Fa95HIOZ8bwMYujdwoVI7dhh4JL-XvKrtUxCoAPGYMfCUQa4pqz5kolVcIDJSD85erfm6wjTvnhVFsUBdeJXZ24KG9j0d1pASVWIWAYL88UEc5k2T8SuC1469Ocuneqa_oqRuFeGbgXbRu6qt7QOPtm20V1-LACtO1sxr9_MaOi92C5x5eEEjELuymmJxO7JWoEj8kKlGFTXxat2RWD1jdRSkI55mUPGFQLksJbg7hho-lHmg5AbE45F0hXMvknLVfnn8Rm27ebVEcCIvWUOBHs6aCpVPk_qbxNtHYP-vDVTm9EV5aZOKMA4vWU0WQkoWMjs5Ptgef8Z5awER-c6ySsPGbOw1OsO_dTGbu43h064Z8D5g9bSadBSpNYuTPkJTwY7fmabLOIc7y=w1461-h1095-no)
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What year, James?