CRG Discussion Forum
Model Specific Discussions => Trans-Am Camaros => Topic started by: bossboy302 on November 20, 2017, 04:44:27 PM
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In the process of freshening up the Alan Green Camaro. Trying to correct a few details. Paint question:
The current notes list the colors as:
'87-'93 GM Pickup White
'67-'68 GM Hugger Green Metallic
I'm no GM guy, but don't think these are the colors used in 1967. While the '67 color chart lists "Ermine White" (which I believe is the original base color) I find no reference to the green. I'm somehow reminded that Alan Green Chevrolet may have used a 'special mix' green of their own concoction, as used on the Alan Green Cheetah. Can anyone confirm this, or point me in direction of correct color(s)? Thanks
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I think the Nova has been restored. May be the same color? Pictures of the Nova appear on the HAMB from time to time.
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Jon Mello knows all things Trans Am Camaro, hopefully he'll see this and give you some answers.
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The Green on the T/a car sure looks groovy, brite metallic green with medium flake
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'87-'93 GM Pickup White
'67-'68 GM Hugger Green Metallic
I have personally never heard of "Hugger Green Metallic". The color looks a lot like the 68 Rally Green. It may be a custom or color that GM offered for another line.
As for the "87-93 Pickup White", that's certainly not what they used in 67. But it could have been any white offered by GM, not just Ermine White.
Or they could have been anything from a paint manufacturers color chart or another car manufacturers line. When you're looking for a showcase color, you just don't have to stay brand specific.
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The car was originally T-T Capri Cream. I don't know the shade of green they used for the stripes. In '67, the pinstripes around the stripes were left black and only the inside of the stripes was green.
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Thanks, Jon...
I vaguely remember being told the green color as a custom AG mix, since the dealer had a body shop, it would have been easy.
Will check the many period photos I have (mostly b&w) for the black outline.
Thanks again
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Do you have this one?
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Stripe goes around camaro emblem on the trunk Nice touch to do this
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Chevrolet emblem I should say
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Thanks for the pic. Yes, I have this one, but not as clear as this. Definitely a black surround. Number and circle, too.
Are those emblems "Chevrolet" and "Camaro"? Car currently has neither. Thanks!
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Here's a color pic of the car from Sebring in March '67. You can see the white roundel for the number is not the same shade as the color of the car. Even in a b&w shot you can see the shades are not the same. The letter T is the paint code used for Capri Cream that year. The green has got to be a custom shade. I've never seen a stock GM green that looked like that.
The rectangular emblem below the Chevrolet emblem on the trunk does say Camaro on it. If you're going to leave the rear spoiler on Tony's car, and I assume you are, then you should forget about bothering with the emblems as they would mostly be covered up by the spoiler if left in that position.
Also, note the "Alan Green Chevrolet" lettering on the fender was originally black, not green.
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Thanks Jon (and all) for the great intel.
I am hoping to convince the owner to ditch the rear spoiler, and add in the black as needed.
If the spoiler is a must, maybe we can add a '68 spoiler.
If needed, I'll mount the emblems higher on the deckled as was done for spoilers.
This photo will go a long way to making my case.
More to come....Happy T-day!
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First happy Thanksgiving day !
Don't want to divert the thread, wondering why the "Green" '67 Camaro changed colours during the '67 season. Later in the year the car is a dark colour with no stripes, I only have B&W pics.
In '68 the car is dark (is it Green ?) with white stripes, Jon had posted a photo of the car at Kent. Is this the '67 car skinned as a '68, side markers, no vent doors ?
I have seen a slot model of the car, the Sebring '67 colours are reversed.
Not sure about the accuracy of some results on the net, some on "Racing Sports Cars" I have these, I think Jon might have put them up here somewhere at some point. Not sure about Kent at the bottom of the list, two different events ?
Mike in Canada
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Here's a pic of that slot car I mentioned in my last post.
Mike
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Happy Thanksgiving to you too, Brian. I would love to see you talk Tony into ditching the rear spoiler and having it look just like it did at Sebring. That would be seriously cool.
Mike, yes the 2nd Kent race was from '68, the other races shown are from '67 although this car was not at all of them so I'm not sure why they are listed like that. The car did get changed to dark green in late '67, I'm not sure why they didn't wait until after the season to do it. The green on that car model is not accurate but I don't think I have a color picture to show you.
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Here's a color pic of the car from Sebring in March '67. You can see the white roundel for the number is not the same shade as the color of the car. Even in a b&w shot you can see the shades are not the same. The letter T is the paint code used for Capri Cream that year. The green has got to be a custom shade. I've never seen a stock GM green that looked like that.
The rectangular emblem below the Chevrolet emblem on the trunk does say Camaro on it. If you're going to leave the rear spoiler on Tony's car, and I assume you are, then you should forget about bothering with the emblems as they would mostly be covered up by the spoiler if left in that position.
Also, note the "Alan Green Chevrolet" lettering on the fender was originally black, not green.
Allowing for photographic 'interpretation', the green color in this photo appears very, very close to the trunk lid color that we found under the white. I believe this trunk lid was once painted green, perhaps the one time the car ran green with white 'outline' stripes, or maybe from the sister car that was reportedly painted in an opposite fashion.
Maybe another GM green available in 1967. Maybe a custom mix.
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Cadillac had a firemist color that was close to this. But I thought the firemist colors were early '70's.
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Show us a picture of the green paint you're talking about, Brian. You're saying it's the same color as on the slot car?
Attached is a photo of Gary Gove sitting in the car in late '67. It sure seems to be a dark green at that time. Also note the interior is basically all black unlike the black and gray combo it is now. Tony has a binder on the car with Gary Gove's phone number and address. Try contacting Gary to see if he knows what color green they used. Also, the original mechanic Larry Webb may also know, if he is still around.
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Here's a colour chart for '64 Cadi's, they offered a green in "Fire Mist & Fire Frost" through '67 and beyond.
Google Cadi Colour charts for various years, I didn't want to post them all here.
Once again, colour reproduction is not the best, and I'm sure some of these charts are faded.
Mike
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The car is now bare metal and sealed. Sheetmetal work underway. A host of prior damage/repairs.
No question this car was once green, as media strip revealed green all over, not just deckled as previously thought.
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That's exciting to hear, Brian. We'd love to see progress pics if Tony was OK with that.
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Well, where has the time gone....
As with large projects such as this, it gets done when time allows....which is code for very slowly.
The bodywork is complete. The replacement RF fender has been flared and shaped to match the survivor. The real chore was the rear. There was so much structure missing. The partition, parcel shelf, and hinge support (and hinges) had all been cut out and tossed years ago. So much of the trunk floor had been cut out that you could put your hand INSIDE the frame rails....there was no top! Obviously the rear leaf spring mounts were left in the breeze. Handling should be vastly improved. The real key was the correctly dated '67 deck lid. (thanks Chad, Jon). It has been modified for the fuel filler and will look (and raise on hinges) exactly like it did in '67. No spoiler. The old deck lid (with spoiler) will be fitted, prepped, and painted so owner has the choice. Prior damage required the replacement of the rear tail light panel and the rear window filler. I will be adding the lower deco strip along the rocker panels as appeared at Sebring '67.
The car will be painted next month. One thing I need is a correct stripe stencil/template. Please feel free to point me in the right direction for those.
Happy to post pics, but being denied due to file size. If there is a way.......
Thanks.
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Thanks for the update, Brian. Sounds like you are making nice progress and fixing some stuff that really needed the attention. Stencils & Stripes makes a template for laying out the stripes. I have an original paint '67 Z trunk lid I can loan you to help mock those stripes up in the rear. I'm having some computer issues right now but might be able to post some of your pictures if you send them to my personal email.
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Here are a couple of restoration pics from Brian.
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The car is now painted white, er, rather the correct Capri Cream, and awaiting stripes. Looking very good. Question on the correct emblems for an early Z: Appears to be a "Chevrolet" and Camaro" together on the rear deckled and the front header panel. On the rear, the rally stripes 'clear' the emblems. Same on the front? Thx.
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I don't recall seeing many Capri Cream cars, should be very good looking when finished.
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Here are a couple of restoration pics from Brian.
That is a unique looking fuel filler setup. Doesn't look like it would fill very quickly.
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Stripes. Green with correct black outline.
Now, this color appears a bit darker than what was previously on the car, however, in the sunlight, it appears close to the many photos available of the Alan Green Cheetah. Could never find anyone to confirm what color green was used in 1967, we chose a 1967 Cadillac color "Tropic Green Firemist".
It will look killer in the sun!
Next up polishing, then the sign painter to hand letter the "ALAN GREEN CHEVROLET" in era-correct black, and "GO GO GREEN" on decklid. The window trim is out for polish, and much of the interior will be returned to its correct black.
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Thanks for posting those photos, Brian. The car is looking pretty awesome and I'm very happy with what you are doing. I hope Tony is also.
I do think the green on the stripes does seem a little darker than original but it's hard to say for sure. With no actual info to go on, you've done the best that can probably be done and I do think it will look very good.
Yes, the front stripe should be cut out around the C on the Chevrolet emblem on the front header panel. I have tried to find a good picture of that but so far no luck.
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Thanks, Jon.
Yes, the color is darker than previous paint. I do feel that it will be much closer to what it was back in '67, if a bit darker.
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I'm really excited to see the finished product. This car really deserves the kind of restoration that you have been doing to it so kudos to you and Tony for the time and effort.
Here is a picture of the paint cutout on the front header panel. Not the greatest shot but better than nothing.
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Jon, you beat me to it ! lot better than I have to offer !
Brian, the car is looking great !
As for the emblem and stripe configuration, I'm sure Jon will come up with something from his extensive files, the car appeared in a number of publications.
There is this, not the best, this is the pre production Z tested at Riverside in late '66. Jon is this stripe/emblem relationship representative of the production item ? (this image is from the Michael Lamm "The Great Camaro" book) it looks like there is a slight cut out on the stripe for the C.
Don't want to side track the thread, but have some questions regarding that first year.
Jon, I know this is probably already been covered here, did all '67 Zs come with stripes ? or was it a delete option ? I see some early photos with and with out ?
I also have images where there are no emblems, were they deleted to save a few ounces on race cars ?
I also have seen images of race cars with the bumble bee stripe on the nose, were some SS/RS cars converted to 302s due to a lack of availability of Z's that first year ? would there have been extra 302 engines able to be ordered, or did some build there own ?
Thanks, Mike
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I think the picture I posted is a better reference for the stripe cutout around the emblem.
Several people tried to order '67 Zs with no stripes and none of them were successful. I believe 1968 was the first year you could get a Z with no stripes. Yes, race cars would delete emblems to save weight and maybe for other reasons as well. There definitely were SS cars and plain jane Camaros used as a basis for a Trans-Am car. You just needed the 302. Any other questions not related to this specific car, please post in a different thread.
I found a good side shot of the car from Sebring which shows the Alan Green Chevrolet lettering was not just in black but appears to have had shadowing around the letters in green as well.
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Thanks for the latest photos....best yet showing lots of detail; the shadowing, that the "Hilton" is a sticker, door meatball sizing, etc.
Unfortunately, we missed the cut-out for the header emblems, as it was a new piece without holes, and the stencil set had no cutout, although it did in the rear. We may add the nose emblems later. Dang!
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GMP/ACME have just announced their version in 1/18 scale. Their first 1967 versions they have released have been pretty disappointing.
https://www.acmediecast.com/products/details.cfm?ProductNumber=18909&category=1967%2D1969%20Chevrolet%20Camaro
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Thanks for the heads-up on the model.
Here's a picture I just got from Brian showing the re-lettering on the trunk lid.
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Thanks for the heads-up on the model.
I can get them for less than retail, if anyone is interested.
PM me.
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I'd love to be able to tell them that the car will appear quite different than the current images they've probably used to do the model.....
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Latest pic from Brian. March 1967 vs April 2019
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Very nice.
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Here's how it looks in black & white.
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Great color combo.
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The car looks fantastic in that latest picture, especially the B&W version!
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Here are some pics I took at Laguna Seca last weekend where the car made its racing debut after its recent restoration.
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4697%20Alan%20Green%20RH%20front_zpsx0pkwsbz.jpg) (https://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4697%20Alan%20Green%20RH%20front_zpsx0pkwsbz.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4698%20Alan%20Green%20LH%20front_zpsnf1vplxb.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4698%20Alan%20Green%20LH%20front_zpsnf1vplxb.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4695%20Alan%20Green%20LH%20rear_zpsatonbara.jpg) (https://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4695%20Alan%20Green%20LH%20rear_zpsatonbara.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4724%20Alan%20Green%20engine%204_zpsunsv2wsd.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4724%20Alan%20Green%20engine%204_zpsunsv2wsd.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4725%20Alan%20Green%20engine%203_zpssdqx5dl3.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4725%20Alan%20Green%20engine%203_zpssdqx5dl3.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4726%20Alan%20Green%20engine%202_zpsnytsbuwj.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4726%20Alan%20Green%20engine%202_zpsnytsbuwj.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4727%20Alan%20Green%20engine%201_zpshkiya2pw.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4727%20Alan%20Green%20engine%201_zpshkiya2pw.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4728%20Alan%20Green%20LH%20door%20open_zpspwgt3q0r.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4728%20Alan%20Green%20LH%20door%20open_zpspwgt3q0r.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4729%20Alan%20Green%20dash%201_zpsdgc38rgn.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4729%20Alan%20Green%20dash%201_zpsdgc38rgn.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4740%20Alan%20Green%201_zpsqa0eptmo.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4740%20Alan%20Green%201_zpsqa0eptmo.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4741%20Alan%20Green%202_zpsudseqxdu.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4741%20Alan%20Green%202_zpsudseqxdu.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4694.%20LH%20rear%20suspensionjpg_zps2iqdcdxs.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4694.%20LH%20rear%20suspensionjpg_zps2iqdcdxs.jpg.html)
(https://i586.photobucket.com/albums/ss309/1967z28/January%202014/IMG_4693%20Alan%20Green%20rear%20axle_zpsjudrqrra.jpg) (http://s586.photobucket.com/user/1967z28/media/January%202014/IMG_4693%20Alan%20Green%20rear%20axle_zpsjudrqrra.jpg.html)
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Thanks for the pics Jon.
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Go Go Green!
It is always nice to see this car run at Kent.
Thanks again to Tony for the Shirt, was a "Mean Joe Greene" Moment back a few years ago
JIM
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GMP/ACME have just announced their version in 1/18 scale. Their first 1967 versions they have released have been pretty disappointing.
https://www.acmediecast.com/products/details.cfm?ProductNumber=18909&category=1967%2D1969%20Chevrolet%20Camaro
Just took delivery of the ACME 1/18 scale diecast version of the Alan Green Camaro. As a diecast collector, I have to say that I am pretty disappointed with the model, compared to the former quality of the GMP molds that the model is supposedly based on.
Here are some pictures, I can answer questions if appropriate, or take other pictures if requested.
https://flic.kr/s/aHsmGENZ8k