CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: Fanthomgreen69 on July 17, 2017, 08:44:58 PM
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Anyone know if this company is still in business? Called the # on their website and got a recording that it is no longer a working #. Found a # from '09 on this website. It did ring and got a generic VM. Left a msg. Doing the research, sounds like a good product, inexpensive and easy to use. Is there another company that offers the same type of product?
Charles
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What is the product ?
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They sell a phosphating solution. Works great and I hope they are still around.
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Pulled out the bottles I bought several years ago and the label reads Owens Group, LLC, d/b/a Palmetto Enterprises, 12 Lovalley Way, Taylors, SC 29687, 864-907-4751. No website as far as I know.
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http://www.palmettoenterprises.net/Palmetto_Enterprises/-About_Palmetto_Enterprises-.html
Try this.
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Did get a call back from the older #. The lady told me they closed down the business(Owens, Group), due to too much red tape involved. Wished they had taken down their website. I did find a couple of other sites that have similar products, Allegheny Armory and Brownell. Will look into their products.
Charles
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Don't know if they have a phosphate kit. But Caswell Plating does have black oxide, bluing, and cad plating. Number is 855-CASWELL or look online for Caswell Plating, Lyons NY
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Try this email:
Anthony Owens <aso9592@gmail.com>
I bought a bottle last November. Let us know if it works.
Stuff does work great.
Might try here too:
http://www.lauerweaponry.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_ID=1104
although I have never tried that stuff. I think the concentration varies from manufacture's. The Palmetto stuff didn't need anywhere near a gallon. i bought a quart and it made 5 gallons.
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The email address above (aso9592@gmail.com) is the best and only way to contact Scott (Anthony Owens) that I know of. I just purchased 3 quarts of the Zinc (gray) and he seems to currently have more of that but unfortunately according to him I just bought the very last quart of Manganese (black) that he has. He said he is hoping to have a new source by the end of the year.
I sure hope so because his stuff works great!
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Just contact brownells.com for zinc phosphate parkerizing and/or manganese parkerizing solutions.
Mike
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Did see Brownell, but called Allegheny Arsenal and ordered their Zinc Parkerizing kit for $29.95 + $13.00 shipping. Shipping was fast. Will see how it works.
Charles
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The email address above (aso9592@gmail.com) is the best and only way to contact Scott (Anthony Owens) that I know of. I just purchased 3 quarts of the Zinc (gray) and he seems to currently have more of that but unfortunately according to him I just bought the very last quart of Manganese (black) that he has. He said he is hoping to have a new source by the end of the year.
I sure hope so because his stuff works great!
That's interesting as he told me a few months ago he did not have any Manganese to sell, only the gray since his supplier stopped making but was hoping to have another supplier soon. Time to move to other suppliers I believe.
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Chick, at first he told me that he had no more Manganese too and would not be getting any anytime soon but then I guess he found one bottle that he said someone had ordered in the past but never paid for and offered it to me.
If you are in a pinch for some I'll share half my bottle with you. :)
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Chick, at first he told me that he had no more Manganese too and would not be getting any anytime soon but then I guess he found one bottle that he said someone had ordered in the past but never paid for and offered it to me.
If you are in a pinch for some I'll share half my bottle with you. :)
Thanks Len as the offer is much appreciated! Luckily, had a friend who lent me some so I'm good but I have written down potential suppliers for the future aforementioned.
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To all, I am back in business after a long period of going back and forth with my raw materials supplier. Finally got it nailed down for good and I now have both products, Manganese and Zinc. Same quality as before. I will never sell stuff that doesn't perform the way the customer needs or expects it to. Goin to have to come up with a new website, working on that right now, but if anyone is still interested in the products then I can be reach at aso9592@gmail.com or by phone, 864-386-6331. Thanks to all the folks who have used the stuff in the past and posted such amazing comments on line! Scott Owens
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Great. Fun to use you products to cook my bolts!!
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That's fantastic news!! I've been conserving what I had left... :)
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Stuff works great.
Got some white "floaties" in my premixed-reused solution. Doesn't seem to affect anything as far as performance. Any concerns?
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Are you guys using it mostly on bolts? or what other items are you using it on?
What is the process for using it on bolts that is the most simple?
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Mostly bolts, nuts, hardware, but you can do anything that was originally phosphated...
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Are you guys using it mostly on bolts? or what other items are you using it on?
What is the process for using it on bolts that is the most simple?
The big parts on our cars are the hood hinges-springs and the hood release mechanism in front of the rad support.
Other non-fastener items CAN be the Hurst shifter mount plate, the Hurst shifter housing (check first, it varies on when made), shifter-backdrive linkage.
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Welcome back Scott! Great product and great customer service. I'm gonna need more if I am ever gonna finish my 70 Z/28 project!
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I used a hot plate and cheap pan. Mine didnt get quite as hot as i would have liked but left in a bit longer. Worked great. I did all my bolts
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I have a quart on order (ZINC Version)
I will post some pics before and after & in process. (Hood, Hinges, Hood Hinge springs, Clutch Z-bar, Hood Latch & Catch, Heater hose inner fender clamp.)
Tech Link
https://www.metcoat.com/phosphate-coatings.htm
JIM
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Hood hinges and latch catch are manganese phosphate. Bigger darker almost black crystals, must be oiled and is used for applications where parts rub one another.
The black Zinc on bolts is a passivation conversion from silver zinc using a chemical dip.
Same with Yellow, Clear, and Olive. ALL four are Passivation conversions of silver zinc which modify the surface of the ZINC coating into a harder surface more resistant to abrasion and corrosion.
FWIW I have been ZINC plating parts lately and as a sample I have had a fender shim laying in the driveway since January and it has yet to show a spec of rust yet.
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Hood hinges and latch catch are manganese phosphate. Bigger darker almost black crystals, must be oiled and is used for applications where parts rub one another.
The black Zinc on bolts is a passivation conversion from silver zinc using a chemical dip.
Same with Yellow, Clear, and Olive. ALL four are Passivation conversions of silver zinc which modify the surface of the ZINC coating into a harder surface more resistant to abrasion and corrosion.
FWIW I have been ZINC plating parts lately and as a sample I have had a fender shim laying in the driveway since January and it has yet to show a spec of rust yet.
First I've heard about the hinges and release mechanism being manganese phosphated. When I stripped the paint from my originals, they were a lighter grey more like zinc phosphate. When i zinc'd mine they came out a dead ringer for the original grey.
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I used a hot plate and cheap pan. Mine didnt get quite as hot as i would have liked but left in a bit longer. Worked great. I did all my bolts
DITTO! Also, per this site suggestion, I get a crockpot going. For storage, I label small ziplock bags, shoot the fasteners with a healthy dose of wd40, refillable squirt bottle. Once assembled, and the wd40 evaporates, I treat with sharkhide or restoguard dry. Both products appear to be fine quality.
When stripped, my hood hinges look gray with black streaks, springs black. I was going to farm those out, along with the z bar and hood release. Now my train of thought is just picking up a cheap roaster and giving it a go.
Since your inquiring bullet, product is reusable a few times. When done, just run through a paint strainer. When finish quality starts suffering, just mix a new batch. Pick up a candy thermometer to watch temp.
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My used solution get whites "flakes" that tend float around in it. It still seems to work OK. Any idea what these are?
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I know he mentioned that using HARD water instead of distilled water can cause surface finish streaking, & maintaining your ph range is critical to the solutions effectiveness.
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I know he mentioned that using HARD water instead of distilled water can cause surface finish streaking, & maintaining your ph range is critical to the solutions effectiveness.
I've only been using distilled water.
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I think the flakes might be "SALTS" precipitation, Filter them out with a coffee filter- one possible "solution" (Pun intended!)
I need to purchase some Ph testing strips to keep tabs on my concentration levels and "sweeten" the solution periodically to maintain effectiveness.
JIM
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I think the flakes might be "SALTS" precipitation, Filter them out with a coffee filter- one possible "solution" (Pun intended!)
I need to purchase some Ph testing strips to keep tabs on my concentration levels and "sweeten" the solution periodically to maintain effectiveness.
JIM
Jackpot! I think you are correct.
Good idea on the Ph. I wonder what a good "range" would be?
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Jackpot! I think you are correct.
Good idea on the Ph. I wonder what a good "range" would be?
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He Told me over the phone & I have them in my notes at home. It was a tight range and requires ordering some or finding some stripes that are not generic and yet easy to read.
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pH meter?
https://www.amazon.com/VANTAKOOL-Accuracy-Measurement-Household-Drinking/dp/B0789G7MVP/ref=lp_393271011_1_1?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1527080870&sr=1-1
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Those flakes are a normal byproduct of the phosphate process. Just filter the solution through a coffee filter to remove them. If the flakes are allowed to sit in the tank or pot then it will eventually develop a thick crust on the bottom and sides.
Keep the phosphate solution temp between 160-190. If you let the solution boil then you'll likely see more flakes. For pure water I use deionized water (DI) from an item used in the aquarium hobby called The Tape Water Purifier. It’s a low cost way to get pure water compared to the more costly Reverse Osmosis (RO) filters. The one thing to do so as to prevent streaking on larger parts is clean, clean, clean and wear gloves when handling the parts before the phosphate bath. This is what we do when treating firearms and the solutions are the same but sold under the name of Parkerizing and you can get that for either gray or black phosphate.
When I plate the bolts, nuts, washers or pulleys I'll de-grease them followed by glass beading then placed in a jar of denatured alcohol (small hardware) until I'm ready to plate. The larger items like water pump & alternator pulleys I'll put in a pot of boiling water before they get put into the phosphate solution to remove any possible oils and that also brings the larger parts to a higher temp so when they get placed into the phosphate bath, the process starts almost immediately. This works for me with car and gun parts.
The one important thing is to pre-condition the new phosphate bath with a fine iron particles in a coffee strainer to get a good finish when first using the solution. Here is a link to a PDF outlining the process used in the firearms hobby:
https://www.brownells.com/userdocs/learn/Inst-482%20Parkerizing.pdf
Mike
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Mike, Thank you for the Link that is one good resource!
just about as good as MIL-DTL-16232G & I went to our local Naval plating plant and obtained their local engineered procedure.
Funny guys here are talking about phosphating bolts, when I was under the impression most "hardware" was post mfr. treated via a Black Oxide Coating for ferrous alloys which is a different process than photsphating.
just a suggestion a Alkaline Rinse (W hot & cold water rinse) would be a recommended PARTS activation after your denatured alcohol degreasing, just a thought,,,,
JIM
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I know many industrial fasteners are black oxided, which is a multi-step process and as such more costly than manganese (dark) or zinc phosphating. My understanding is that due to cost savings GM went with phosphating most fasteners-brackets. There are some exceptions.
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As many have described the white stuff that shows up on hardware after manganese or phosphate process is salts related or what I have found. I used to use WD-40 as Palmetto suggested that and to clean the parts three times with WD-40. Using a tooth brush scrubbing the parts seemed to eliminate the issue but I found an easier way using good old red Mystery Oil. I just take the parts out of the solution and drop in the mystery oil and then at some point take them out and wipe off. Not one time have I've encountered anymore salts (white deposits) on hardware after the chemical bath. I also use a hot plate as it cannot get the solution to boiling and maintains approximately 180 degrees.
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Anyone know if this company is still in business? Called the # on their website and got a recording that it is no longer a working #. Found a # from '09 on this website. It did ring and got a generic VM. Left a msg. Doing the research, sounds like a good product, inexpensive and easy to use. Is there another company that offers the same type of product?
Charles
I know a Chinese filter element company(www.zhehanfilter.com) can offer similar products. You can ask them on their website.
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Anyone know if this company is still in business? Called the # on their website and got a recording that it is no longer a working #. Found a # from '09 on this website. It did ring and got a generic VM. Left a msg. Doing the research, sounds like a good product, inexpensive and easy to use. Is there another company that offers the same type of product?
Charles
I know a Chinese filter element company(www.zhehanfilter.com) can offer similar products. You can ask them on their website.
Selling on eBay:
https://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?LH_AvailTo=1&_ssn=palmettoenterprises_21&_fcid=1&_sop=12