CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: jim28607 on September 06, 2016, 07:03:22 AM
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http://charlotte.craigslist.org/pts/5683746202.html
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Cool! 8)
...wonder what it will go for..... ::)
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Cool - yes. But not truly an orphan. It's described as a warranty engine - and was never installed in a car at the assembly plant.
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Might be an orphan with doc,s showing it being installed in a real car.
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That would be a tough sell, as it was cast on 7/31/69. Last production ZL1 Camaro was final-assembled June 2, 1969.
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If it was a warranty exchange ZL1 block, it would still have a CE code and there's no mention of that. Without docs (and no mention of that either), it's just a service "over the counter block". Is it worth the asking price of $20k? Hardly (IMO).
By the way, he's had that ad on CL for almost a year now with no takers.
Ed
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Right. Doesn't have the normal CE stamp but I am not sure any of the aluminum blocks did. I think I have seen at least one with AS and a number.
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Doesn't have the normal CE stamp but I am not sure any of the aluminum blocks did.
I would say that's probably because most of the blocks we see were over the counter service items with no info stamped on them. But I'd have to bow to what William and/or Kurt have to say about CE ZL1 blocks.
Ed
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That would be a tough sell, as it was cast on 7/31/69. Last production ZL1 Camaro was final-assembled June 2, 1969.
i agree that the block was likely an OTC block (and MOST ZL-1 engines/blocks were OTC)... many more sold OTC than were installed in cars.. Re value: There was one for sale a year or two ago (NOS in the crate in the Nashville area for $10K...
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I really don't get it about these ZL-1 parts? If it's not the original car with the original engine, etc., it just another camaro to me.
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Doesn't have the normal CE stamp but I am not sure any of the aluminum blocks did.
I would say that's probably because most of the blocks we see were over the counter service items with no info stamped on them. But I'd have to bow to what William and/or Kurt have to say about CE ZL1 blocks.
Ed
Fact is there probably weren't many warranty claims on them. Over half were raced, voiding the warranty. About 10 lost the original engine fairly soon through a swap or theft.
I know of two warranty failures on street-driven ZL1s: #55 and #69. #55 has a known history and scuffed a piston. I believe it got a warranty short-block; the original was not scrapped and is back with the car. Back in the '80s when I was chasing them I spoke to the new car manager at Huebner Chev, who ordered #69. Said it sat around for months, they put stripes & mags on it and it finally sold. Towed in a day or so later with a fragged engine. He distinctly remembered receiving an entire ZL1 engine in a crate to repair it. It's possible it was serviced with another ML engine. A few years ago an ML ZL1 engine was discovered w/o VIN. There were 54 ML engines built; 47 were used in production.
The warranty period began when the car was sold; some ZL1 Camaros weren't sold until 1970. Chevy had to service those cars until the mid-'70s. They produced far more ZL1 engines than needed for production so it is possible a few were retained for warranty obligations.
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#55 has a known history and scuffed a piston. I believe it got a warranty short-block
William, do you know if that warranty short block had a CE stamp?
Ed
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Weren't some of the engines swapped even before the cars were sold? Or is that urban myth? Of the 69, how many still actually have the original engine?
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#55 has a known history and scuffed a piston. I believe it got a warranty short-block
William, do you know if that warranty short block had a CE stamp?
Ed
Don't know; I vaguely recall that the guys that bought it off the '80s Super Chevy ad swapped whatever was in it for an engine with a Corvette code. The thinking was that was an improvement. Both the March 1991 Car Craft and October 1991 Musclecar Classics features on #55 mention it received a replacement 'block' when it was six months old. CE components were built to order and the Car Craft feature states "It took months for the rare race piece to emerge from the GM warranty system..."
Currently #55 is the pick of the litter. One of two RS, unrestored, under 10,000 miles.
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Don't know; I vaguely recall that the guys that bought it off the '80s Super Chevy ad swapped whatever was in it for an engine with a Corvette code. The thinking was that was an improvement. Both the March 1991 Car Craft and October 1991 Musclecar Classics features on #55 mention it received a replacement 'block' when it was six months old. CE components were built to order and the Car Craft feature states "It took months for the rare race piece to emerge from the GM warranty system..."
Thanks William. If it came from the factory as a short block, I'd be willing to bet it did. If it was just the block (as stated in the articles), then probably not.
Ed
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Weren't some of the engines swapped even before the cars were sold? Or is that urban myth? Of the 69, how many still actually have the original engine?
With the $7300+ list price they were near impossible to sell. It's known that some were acquired only for the ZL1 engine and sold with L72 engines. Several were stolen new and the engines taken. Our project, the #4 ZL1, was raced for the '70 NHRA season with the original engine. The dealer swapped out the ZL1 for a 402 and sold it off the used car lot April '71.
Some of the cars have been reunited with their original ZL1 engines; most recently #65. Best current estimate is 18 have the original engine; 'engine' is defined here as the original VIN-stamped block. There are 5 other engines known to exist that are not with the car for whatever reason. 8 other production ZL1 engines exist but the cars they belong to have been scrapped or just aren't known. A few restored cars have production engines from one of the other cars.