CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: BillOhio on July 09, 2016, 09:57:55 PM
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I was up till 2 am last night doing finishing touches on my Z, and took it to its first show today. I was thrilled for the car to win best first generation Camaro! I want to thank everyone who gave me advice, opinions, a few of you did some work for me. It is finally done! I got a few little things I could do and the reproduction battery decides after 3 years it's good for 3 starts and I get to the show and dead in the trailer. The pace car in the background is owned by Dave Roberts of Right Stuff detailing.
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Car looks amazing and congrats!!
BTW we need more pics than that!!! Come on!!! Tease.
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Congratulations, Bill! You should be proud! I'm happy for you.
Hopefully I'll be able to show mine next year and enjoy some of that good feeling.
Mike
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Burgundy ROCKS!
She's a beauty Bill!
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I thought it should have posted a couple more so I will add them. And I know it should not have the screw holding the heater hose clip to the alternator but I should have a bolt in the mail for that today. Haha.
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Great looking car Bill ! Were you at Good guys Today? Couldn't have asked for better weather!
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Bill,
What are those two white stripes on the left head?
Mike
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Stunning looking car, the wait was worth it. Bill it turned out awesome, now you just need the orange "caution fan" sticker and your all set for the show circuit... ;D
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I have never been down to the good guys show. This was the Arthritis Foundation in Dublin. Those two stripes were on the head from the factory. You could also see what looks like ok under the number one cylinder on the side of the block. Steve Shauger told me he had seen those stripes before. I could see if it said DZ on the Block but look more like ok maybe it was upside down writing or something weird
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Here's the head before I started
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Here's the side of the block
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Interesting.......are those stripes some sort of white grease marker or paint?
Mike
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They looked like it. The block was after it was cleaned. My engine guy has some kind of cabinet that rotates part and I think it blasted with hot water so those marks for under paint
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Super job! Congrats on a great looking car!!
Enjoying the pictures!
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That thing DAZZLES!! congrats.
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Burgundy ROCKS!
She's a beauty Bill!
Absolutely... :) I love it...
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Great looking car, Bill! Congratulations
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Without this site and helpful members, and the assembly manual, this would be challenge. Some days it was anyway!
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Its a good feeling Bill, just ask me! LOL
And as others have mentioned that color is just outstanding looking. I'd love to have one that color!
Congratulations!
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Bill, if your not doing anything, tote it up to Norwalk next weekend.(Bluesuede) We're running the Anglia in Nostalgic gas. We will be there Thursday through Sunday. Trailer, motorhome, Mule...going to race(sandbag) Kid's bringing down the 38 International. Whole family is going to be there. Stop buy and have a cold one. Let me know, I'll throw the slicks off the Z in the trailer if you want to blow a little carbon out of that 302 ;D Fun runs all weekend.(Spectator side) We're set up to tune it if need be.
Car looks fan @#$#ntastic!
Dublin's a beautiful town$$. We stayed there when we did Goodguys...about 24 years ago. Picked up a set of plug wires from the old Jegs.
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Looks fantastic, Bill, and the color can't be beat! (Ok, I'm predujidiced, but us burgundy guys gotta stick together!)
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Good for you Bill. Looks amazing. Enjoy it!
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Jano thanks for the invite and it could use some tuning but I don't think i would be brave enough for a track run yet! It has 3 miles on it from taking it to the alignment shop and that's it. I will try and get a you tube video of it and have it running. I did leave the 140 cam in it the original owner installed in 1971. People look at you like you brought a race car to a car show.well, I guess I did!
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Car looks GREAT Bill! I also have a '69 Burgundy Coupe and I love the color. You did a really good job, congrats!!
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Jano thanks for the invite and it could use some tuning but I don't think i would be brave enough for a track run yet! It has 3 miles on it from taking it to the alignment shop and that's it. I will try and get a you tube video of it and have it running. I did leave the 140 cam in it the original owner installed in 1971. People look at you like you brought a race car to a car show.well, I guess I did!
Yea, I say it in jest. These cars are way too rare to hammer at the track. You can get a drag car for a fraction of the cost..not to say anything wrong with a nice 'lobe" at idle !
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I agree. I would like to hear a video of the lope of that cam. I guess we all hope you get a good battery first... :)
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Got a Walmart in it at the moment!
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With a battery topper who would know? ;)
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Cook's did come out nice.
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Beautiful car Bill... congrats, not just the win but on the ownership of the car!
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Thanks James. It's a relief to get it out of where my dad keeps his car and into my garage. I thought it would be home when he got back from Florida, ah hmm, April lol. I have some kind of odd low vacuum issue and working on that. Even down to took of drivers side valve cover tonight. I understand why smog equipment got tossed! I don't get into getting a trophy, but enjoy going and hanging out with my friends and looking at cars. I think there were 1000 there. We have a show that big this weekend but calling for 95 degrees and it's downtown with fair sized buildings and no breeze. I can skip one.
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Bill, is low vacuum messing with your brakes like it does mine? With my idle speed around 1100-1200 RPM, I seem to get one good power-assisted brake before I either have to stand on the brake pedal or blip the gas to get some vac back (this is putting around a parking lot at slow-speed obviously).
I'm going to my first show Saturday with temps expected around 97, and humidity right up there with it. I bought a canopy to sit under for shade, and we're bringing plenty of ice... I really hope this first show isn't miserable for the wife...I hate to set the tone for future ones!
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You may have that if timing isn't tweaked.
Mine was the same way, even with the stock 30-30 cam. Plus living at 5,000 ft where the engine doesn't make quite as much vacuum compounds the problem. The fix is to run more initial timing, limit the centrifugal, and run your vacuum advance to manifold vacuum source for a bit extra timing at idle, then adjust the carb accordingly. Once setup properly the engine will produce 3-6 inches more vacuum.
For example on mine, up here at this elevation with stockish timing settings and the vacuum advance hooked to ported on the carb, my engine only made 5 inches. Not enough for brakes. One good stop was all it had.
I ended up soldering the centrifugal advance slot to limit that to 16 degrees. I set my initial timing at 20 degrees (together 36 total) I then dialed in vacuum advance with a limiter screwed down to the rear arm on the breaker plate made out of a penny. Old trick as they don't sell the limiter plates anymore that I can find. Making one out of a penny takes 2 minutes. I limit the vacuum advance to about 12 degrees this way and then run it directly to a manifold source to add 10-12 degrees to idle timing. So technically the idle timing is about 30-32 degrees (initial plus vacuum together) This added timing goes away however as soon as you step on the gas and vacuum drops, and you centrifugal takes over when under load. At light throttle cruising with everything together you end up with 45-47ish timing give or take while cruising, which works perfectly, good drivability and better gas mileage. Works fine at 11:1 with the 30-30 cam on pump gas.
This is how I set up most distributors for customers that have large overlap camshafts, as it tends to smooth the idle a bit, makes carb tuning a bit easier, and helps the engine produce vacuum. With a 140 cam in a little 302 it's going to need tweaks like this for best drivability.
With these tricks my engine is now making about 12 inches of vacuum up here at 5,000 ft which is plenty for power brakes. It stops just fine now.
Hope that helps.
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Mine has 3 inches and that's off the manifold with everything else plugged. Not sure what's going on yet.
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Yup, that's not all that unusual with a 140 cam in a little 302. Mine only had 5 with a 30-30 cam, granted at 5,000 feet but still...
I see this often with cars here. I did a 69 Z last year with a cross ram and 140 cam that came in running terrible. Same deal. Once all dialed in it actually drove fairly decent considering the carb and intake setup (frankly not the best design IMO) But the cool factor so it had to stay.
Doing my fathers now, a stroker 571 street car that made 760 on pump gas. Very radical solid roller and 6 inches of vacuum. I'll squeeze a bit more out of it.
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The Hemi in my gtx had 12 at 600 rpm with a roller and 2 carbs on open plenum intake. I have tried 2 carbs and both at 3 inches
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I have added more initial advanced and didn't pick up vacuum. I did notice if I rev the motor to like 2k, vacuum went to 10. Talked to my engine guy and that puzzled him something strange happening
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Bill
Great work, car is awesome, who doesn't love 69 burgandy.
Mike
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http://www.linnbenton.edu/auto/perform/vacuum.html
You sure you are hooked into MANIFOLD vacuum Bill? and not port?
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Gauge is hooked to the booster fitting on the back of the manifold
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You may have that if timing isn't tweaked.
Mine was the same way, even with the stock 30-30 cam. Plus living at 5,000 ft where the engine doesn't make quite as much vacuum compounds the problem. The fix is to run more initial timing, limit the centrifugal, and run your vacuum advance to manifold vacuum source for a bit extra timing at idle, then adjust the carb accordingly. Once setup properly the engine will produce 3-6 inches more vacuum.
For example on mine, up here at this elevation with stockish timing settings and the vacuum advance hooked to ported on the carb, my engine only made 5 inches. Not enough for brakes. One good stop was all it had.
I ended up soldering the centrifugal advance slot to limit that to 16 degrees. I set my initial timing at 20 degrees (together 36 total) I then dialed in vacuum advance with a limiter screwed down to the rear arm on the breaker plate made out of a penny. Old trick as they don't sell the limiter plates anymore that I can find. Making one out of a penny takes 2 minutes. I limit the vacuum advance to about 12 degrees this way and then run it directly to a manifold source to add 10-12 degrees to idle timing. So technically the idle timing is about 30-32 degrees (initial plus vacuum together) This added timing goes away however as soon as you step on the gas and vacuum drops, and you centrifugal takes over when under load. At light throttle cruising with everything together you end up with 45-47ish timing give or take while cruising, which works perfectly, good drivability and better gas mileage. Works fine at 11:1 with the 30-30 cam on pump gas.
This is how I set up most distributors for customers that have large overlap camshafts, as it tends to smooth the idle a bit, makes carb tuning a bit easier, and helps the engine produce vacuum. With a 140 cam in a little 302 it's going to need tweaks like this for best drivability.
With these tricks my engine is now making about 12 inches of vacuum up here at 5,000 ft which is plenty for power brakes. It stops just fine now.
Hope that helps.
Thanks! You offered these tips to me before I had my car back and was relating "how it used to be" back in the day. I will investigate and probably have more questions.
I didn't intend to hijack Bill's thread, but maybe since he and I have similar problems, we may need similar solutions!
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Hey Bill,, the Z looks great, good job, and you know I like the Burgandy color.
Mike
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Very nice Bill. Great looking car.
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Awesome Z. Great to hear another one is back on the road. Drive it and enjoy it often.
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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MS3bvWjuTiE. Finally got a chance to video it running. Idle was about 900. Distributor has been recurved and one carb I have has an issue. The distributor adjustments did smooth the idle some. I drove about 40 miles to a show today and no problems. Starts right up. Bias plies are fun and drives nice until you get to a weird place in road and it skates sideways. . This is Gardener exhaust with just the transverse muffler.
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Sounds great, and looks even better! Nicely done, Bill!
Paul
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Car looks and sounds great!
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Super! .. in all respects.. :)
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Amazing job, Bill! I can never get enough of that "music"! I'd play it on my stereo if my wife would let me! Your car looks fantastic!
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Thasks Dale. The radio is about the only thing that doesn't work but not planning on fixing it! It's amazing all the original gauge bulbs still work.
I am going to put an adjustable vacuum advance can on this week and will post my results. I have picked a couple inches of vacuum from limiting the mechanical advance and hoping to get a bit more with some performance. Thanks to my new best friend Larry aka X33RS!