CRG Discussion Forum
Model Specific Discussions => 6-cylinder Camaros => Topic started by: Top1motors on April 28, 2015, 05:57:57 AM
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I recently picked this one up locally sitting in a garage for many years and found a hand written bill of sale from 1991 in the glove box. It appears to be from one family member to another (same last name). So I believe it to be a fairly untouched survivor. What I'm curious about is with it being the 118th Camaro built in Van Nuys, would it have been a "day one" car with that low number? Also it has a weird vinyl insert pattern on the seats. It codes as a 741 (red standard) and R-R (Bolero Red) car with only the 3K for any options. I worked in my fathers upholstery shop in the 1980's and know my way around seat repair etc. and these look to be original in every way I know to look for. Could this be a short lived vinyl option that was discontinued? Promotional colors? Also, where do I put the full VIN and trim tag info on this site for the registry?
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A couple more pics of the red 67. Also, it does have incorrect 15 x 7 FW rallys and at some point had a V-8 4 speed installed (hole in tunnel and old dual exhaust still in car). Still has column shift in it.
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What I'm curious about is with it being the 118th Camaro built in Van Nuys, would it have been a "day one" car with that low number?
Body number LOS 889 is sitting in my neighbor's driveway. The trim tag designation is 09C. The pad stamp on the block was VO915. If it is possible to determine the date when the Fisher line began produce bodies, it should be able to extrapolate the possibilities of your car being "day one." What date does the trim tag on LOS 118 indicate? Approximately how many days passed between #118 and #889?
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The build date on my tag is 08D. So the trim tag looks like this:
08D S067
ST 67 12437 LOS 70 BODY
TR 741 Z R-R PAINT
3K
So 4th week of August and low body sequence #'s. Curious about the 741 Z (red standard vimyl and custom bucket seat trim?) what does that mean?
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Curious about the 741 Z (red standard vimyl and custom bucket seat trim?) what does that mean?
"741" indicated red standard bucket seats and "Z" indicated standard A50 Strato Bucket seats (no headrest). Your interior photos above are not factory.
More info here... http://www.camaros.org/numbers.shtml#InteriorColors
Paul
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I can't comment on the interior trim. My limited decoding skills suggest that the car was optioned with "exterior molding group?" The only other thing I can infer is that the car had a red, standard interior.
With regard to the Fisher body number "70", I would suspect that the car could have been either day-one or day-two. Hopefully, others will offer opinions but you should review the information on "LOS - Fisher Body body scheduling code" found on the CRG page. "S" would have corresponded to a particular day of the month (late in the month, commensurate with week "D". As I interpret the explanation, the second part of the code "067" suggests that your car was the 67th vehicle that was started down the Fisher body line on that day. CRG explains that the Van Nuys Fisher plant was producing bodies for vehicles other than Camaro and the numbers referred to ALL bodies begun on that particular day so, it would be likely that your car was very early in the day, especially when compared to other Camaros.
I owned a Norwood '68 Camaro that was tagged O8C and the VIN was 000200. There were fewer different styles on the Ohio line and the production numbers were higher as well so I suspect that the '68 was a day-one car as well.
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Body numbers from LA are tricky, just like to CA is a little odd. There are going to be four LOS 070 body numbers, or any other body number out there (within limits). One from an standard interior coupe, one from a deluxe interior coupe, one from a standard interior convertible and one from a deluxe interior convertible. LA ran 4 different body number sequences on the Camaros (and one can assume the other lines that they built). the lowest vin for body number 070 would probably be on a standard interior coupe, deluxe interior coupe or standard interior convertible would be next, and the deluxe interior convertible would be latest. LA built about 2600 deluxe interior convertibles, so for any body number higher than that theyre would be just 3 others out there with the same numbers.
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Thanks for the input guys. I just got back on here after 4-5 years of not messing with Camaros but I'm back in! I may take the back seat apart and see if there is a GM part # sequence like i've found before on original upholstery materials. It really looks like it came that way. Could it be material from another car line from 1966 like Impala or Malibu etc? Is there any appreciable value added to these early VIN cars just for that fact or no? Thanks again!
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If possible, can you take some photos of the underside of the trunk lid for us? There are some indications that the very early cars did not have emblems on the trunk lid and no access from the underside to attached the speed nuts for the emblems. Also, can you see it there were holes for 6 cylinder emblems on the front fenders under where the Camaro emblem would have been mounted? Thank you.
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John,
Here are the pics. Also added the seat belt buckle style, trim tag and VIN plate. The fender emblem holes are from the driver side (could be L6 layout).There's quite a bit of distance between the "Camaro" and the other holes, height wise. Hard to tell from the pic. Passenger side looks to be covered over with "bondo" as was the header emblem. But as you can see, there are access cut-outs for the trunk emblem and part of the original emblem is still attached. This car had one repaint of red and they didn't even do the jambs or inside the trunk. Still has jack instruction decal "glue" residue.
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Last two pics of trunk emblem
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The picture of the fender emblem holes doesn't look right for a 250 emblem. There should be two holes level on the horizontal plane near the top of the emblem "shield" and one hole at the bottom of the emblem that bisects the line between the two upper holes. The picture seems to show the bottom hole offset to the right of where is should be. Of course, if the engine was originally a 230, there would not have been an engine call-out emblem.
Dan
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It's not often you see the delivery date stamped on the VIN tag.
12/6 on an 08D built car is a long time when these cars where hot sellers in the fall of 1967
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Unfortunately due to the engine and trans swap somewhere along the way makes me think previous owners may have tried to add an emblem on the drivers side. After examining the pass. fender closer it doesn't appear to have been messed with and there are NO lower holes. So that would indicate 230 L6 correct?
As for the 12 6 on the VIN, I had no idea that it denoted a delivery date. And does it mean sold to a customer on 12/6? Or could this car have been ordered by a dealer and left on display? Thus the long time between build and delivery or is the 12 6 showing when the dealer received it? Just want to be clear.
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Unfortunately due to the engine and trans swap somewhere along the way makes me think previous owners may have tried to add an emblem on the drivers side. After examining the pass. fender closer it doesn't appear to have been messed with and there are NO lower holes. So that would indicate 230 L6 correct?
As for the 12 6 on the VIN, I had no idea that it denoted a delivery date. And does it mean sold to a customer on 12/6? Or could this car have been ordered by a dealer and left on display? Thus the long time between build and delivery or is the 12 6 showing when the dealer received it? Just want to be clear.
The lack of engine emblem holes certainly points to an original 230.
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Thanks for posting those pics. How about a shot of the whole underside of the trunk lid? Can you make out a date for it in the middle/lower area when the lid is raised? An example would be T31.
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The 12/6 stamp is the date the dealer delivered it to the first owner. Thats what the DD stands for on the VIN tag Delivery Date (or Dealer Deleivery) and it was intended t be used as the start of the warrantee period. Very few dealers actually stamped the date on the VIN tag. Car was probably a dealer demo car for the first 3 months of its life, then sold in December.
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Car was probably a dealer demo car for the first 3 months of its life, then sold in December.
That's what I was thinking. One of the first cars delivered to the dealer, with a hot color and low MSRP, it was probably used to upsell the customer into a car with a few more options.
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I was thinking like "68ragtop" along the lines of a dealer ordered car to sell off of since it was so plain. Add in the sell date of 12/6 and it does make sense.Still holding on to the idea that the seat inserts were original (special ordered maybe?). Also FYI it does have the front sub frame without access for the rear bumper bracket bolts. What a pain those are. Here are the other inner trunk lid pics. The date "code" is T 32 similar to the number mentioned above. It is upside down when looking at it standing normal (for reference). Thanks again for all the input. This one may be up for sale soon as I've got a lead on a 68 Z28!
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Still holding on to the idea that the seat inserts were original (special ordered maybe?).
Nope, someone recovered the seats. ;)
Paul
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Dang!
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Thanks for the info on the trunk lid. I appreciate it.
I also agree that the seat insert material is not original.
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What does the T 32 indicate on the deck lid?
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It means it was stamped during the 32nd week of the year.
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It means it was stamped during the 32nd week of the year.
2nd week of August 66 FYI
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It looks like the car was built about the fourth day of production, via the work order #.
It was always a ramp-up, esp for a new model.
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Full VIN: 123377L100118
Paul
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Unfortunately due to the engine and trans swap somewhere along the way makes me think previous owners may have tried to add an emblem on the drivers side. After examining the pass. fender closer it doesn't appear to have been messed with and there are NO lower holes. So that would indicate 230 L6 correct?
As for the 12 6 on the VIN, I had no idea that it denoted a delivery date. And does it mean sold to a customer on 12/6? Or could this car have been ordered by a dealer and left on display? Thus the long time between build and delivery or is the 12 6 showing when the dealer received it? Just want to be clear.
I agree it was probably a 230 engine car. That may be part of the reason why it did not sell fast, or the dealer demo idea could be just as valid.
And that is the latest date I have personally seen for a DD stamped date. Not sure when they quit doing that.