CRG Discussion Forum
Camaro Research Group Discussion => Originality => Topic started by: 69Z28 on May 02, 2013, 01:57:41 PM
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Hey guys, I posted on this subject at TC but I wanted to touch base with you all here as well. Not even sure I'm allowed to do this on CRG and I find it's more of a request and questions too. Is it neccesary for that tip on the aluminum starter nose to be closed? I found that I have a BOP(driver side installed instead of passenger side) aluminum nose on the Z starter I have. It is for the 153 tooth flywheel and has the straight across mounting bolt holes. It does however have the tip open so you can see the very end of the armature rod where the bearing is. All the spare starter noses I have are open this way. Are these broken or are they built this way? I know I'll have to remove the Pontiac nose for a Chevy nose when I rebuild the starter, so I tried to order one from GMPARTSDIRECT and found they are discontinued. Anyone have one to sell? or can I use the open tip nose?
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Gary:
Ideally, on a stick shift car you want the nose closed. As your clutch wears, all the dust that is created flys around inside the bell housing. No issue in an auto, but the debris can enter the end of the nose and contribute to wearing out the bushing. Of course, even with the nose closed, the debris can enter from the other side, so I am not sure how much difference there would be long term in the real world.
Having said that, if you find an open nose that otherwise fits, it will work fine. That bushing is really easy to replace, and even easier on an open nose starter. I wouldn't hesitate to use an open nose for now, and keep a look out for the correct nose down the road. One will turn up.
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Thanks Lynn. I was assuming that the open nose would be fine. All the starters I have were at one time used on Chevy and Pontiac engines the past 30 years as spares. All have an open nose tip and all where either on an automatic or a manual shift car. All I did was switch noses around to Chevy or Pontiac for it's application and install new brushes and install. I do want to get a dedicated starter nose for my Z starter though with the covered tip, but Chevy says discontinued, at least online and the local here in Smyrna. So if anyone has a used one I'll take it.
I am currently using a gear reduction starter and want to continue using it, but if it ever fails I at least have the Z starter to fall back on as a reserve. Can't be too careful, always have to have a 'Plan B'. I am doing the same with my distributor as well. I have a Dave's Smallbody HEI set up to the Z specs specified by members here and on TC that I am using, but I also have the original 480 all done up the same and ready to drop in if I ever run into any trouble. Had that happen once already when the Mallory I was using destroyed the cam and distributor gears. I was only 4 miles away, but what if you were 25 or more?
Gary:
Ideally, on a stick shift car you want the nose closed. As your clutch wears, all the dust that is created flys around inside the bell housing. No issue in an auto, but the debris can enter the end of the nose and contribute to wearing out the bushing. Of course, even with the nose closed, the debris can enter from the other side, so I am not sure how much difference there would be long term in the real world.
Having said that, if you find an open nose that otherwise fits, it will work fine. That bushing is really easy to replace, and even easier on an open nose starter. I wouldn't hesitate to use an open nose for now, and keep a look out for the correct nose down the road. One will turn up.
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Check this out fellas.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/67-69-Camaro-Z28-302-NOS-GM-Aluminum-Starter-Housing-Assembly-68-Z-28-JL-8-/130900555917?hash=item1e7a47f88d&item=130900555917&pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr#ht_2591wt_1088
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Very nice part.
Good luck with that auction.
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Good luck! Graffz sells some very good parts and normally is able to pull prem prices due to his record.
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I put a bid in. I do need it. I don't think anyone that has one will let it go. They haven't so far.
Very nice part.
Good luck with that auction.
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Well, I didn't get it. It went for $152.00 anyway. I googled the part number I found for the housing #1968122 and I did find a GM parts seller yesterday and bought one, $37.50 plus $12.00 shipping and handling. If anyone hasn't seen these sites here ya go. As I said in an earlier post, GMPartsDirect refunded my purchase because they said #1968122 was discontinued. Lets hope these guys are good.
http://www.oempartsgarage.com/
http://www.newgmparts.com/partlocator/index.cfm?siteid=213815
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Now here is a 1968122 housing that looks to have a plug inserted in the tip. Hmmmmm. Interesting.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350777835765?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_1061wt_1043
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Gary, if you are OK with that 1968122, then we can talk more. The 1st pic shows the void (right by the flywheel hole) in the casting that mine has. I think that is a feature of the later starter noses. Tim's pic was solid in that spot.
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Hi Kev. I'm not exactly sure which one of the housings I bought, there was no picture. Hopefully it will be like Tims pic. I'm not following you...if I am OK with the 1968122, than we can talk more. The 1st pic shows the void? Are you referrencing the pics on my TC post?
Gary, if you are OK with that 1968122, then we can talk more. The 1st pic shows the void (right by the flywheel hole) in the casting that mine has. I think that is a feature of the later starter noses. Tim's pic was solid in that spot.
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Hey Kev, I went back to look at the pics on TC forum and realized what you mean. Tims pic and the starter on the left of the 3 starter housings I posted, the one with the open tip, have a curved edge at the flywheel opening and the ones I post here on CRG hace a straight edge in the opening. You see what I'm saying. Maybe I'll get lucky and get the correct housing in. Maybe today or tomorrow.
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Well...I struck out again. Just got the dreaded "Unfurtunately we cannot fill your order because the part is DISCONTINUED" email...AGAIN. Stay tuned for the next episode of "The Long Lost Starter Housing". I'm gonna fnd one...someone has to have a few of these laying around and don't know it.
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there must be *thousands* of starters (available everywhere) with the correct nose you need.. *S* just buy a used starter with the correct nose, and reassemble/rebuild it all yourself.. :)
ebay 'GM starters used' ??
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Well... you'll need to search with a few different keys.. Is this the nose you need? You get an entire rebuilt starter if it is. for $59..
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1108367-Z28-CAMARO-CHEVELLE-STARTER-1968-8F26-/150991339853?pt=Vintage_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item2327c9014d&vxp=mtr
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Gary. A few different keys? Heck, I've been online all morning entering any key word remotely resembling a GM starter. I'm looking at this starter for the parts. I made an offer of $40.00 just for the nose piece, bracket and stud but was refused.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/320787669893?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_427wt_806
This one too.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251095515376?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_345wt_806
I really don't want to buy the whole da*n thing but it looks like I may have to if I can't just find the housing. Your right there are millions of these starters out there somewhere. I was hoping someone here would help me out and sell me one. Maybe they aren't as easy to find.
There are 2 more I emailed about for front shots of the housing as well. Just waiting hear back.
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Why don't you just buy THIS ONE (http://store.alternatorparts.com/partno51122delcooe18768811965529196727719681221970310lesterno3631366438003838.aspx) ($26 plus shipping), or go down to your local FLAPS and get a rebuilt starter for $30 and exchange the nose?
Ed
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I did not see that one. I have tried twice at GM parts websites and both say discontinued. I do already have a rebuilt starter for parts but the nose looks a bit chessy to me. I plan on using the guts from it to rebuild my original but I want to get the right nose for it.
I'll order the one from the link you sent and see what happens. Looks more correct then the cheesy looking one I have.
Why don't you just buy THIS ONE (http://store.alternatorparts.com/partno51122delcooe18768811965529196727719681221970310lesterno3631366438003838.aspx) ($26 plus shipping), or go down to your local FLAPS and get a rebuilt starter for $30 and exchange the nose?
Ed
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I found this link if anyone is interested.
http://roadtrip.yearone.com/2010/12/chevy-starter-tech-guide.html
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Gary I don't know how I missed it but I thought you needed a dated starter is the reason I haven't been reading real close. I've got a nose if that's all you need. I'll give it to you if you'll pay the postage. I'll send you a PM.
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Hey Daniel. I sent you a PM. I don't have a problem paying you for it. Is it like what's in reply #3? I got to give you something if it is.
Gary I don't know how I missed it but I thought you needed a dated starter is the reason I haven't been reading real close. I've got a nose if that's all you need. I'll give it to you if you'll pay the postage. I'll send you a PM.
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Hey Daniel. I sent you a PM. I don't have a problem paying you for it. Is it like what's in reply #3? I got to give you something if it is.
Gary I don't know how I missed it but I thought you needed a dated starter is the reason I haven't been reading real close. I've got a nose if that's all you need. I'll give it to you if you'll pay the postage. I'll send you a PM.
Lets get into PMs and don't tie up the MB.